HomeMy WebLinkAboutPark and Recreation Advisory Commission Minutes 06-11-2009MINUTES OF THE PARKS AND RECREATION ADVISORY COMMISSION MEETING
June 11, 2009
PRESENT: Commissioners: M. Smith, G. Anderson, N. Carroll, J. Nelson, P. Knight
Staff: E. Blank, D. Evans, R. Busch, D. Lauer, D. Sankey
City Council Liaison: B. Stein
Planning Commission Liaison D. Kobusson
ABSENT: D. Anderson, A. Vanderwall
1. CALL TO ORDER
Chair Smith called the meeting to order at 7:02 p.m. in the Council Chambers.
2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
Motion was made by Commissioner Anderson and seconded by Commissioner
Carroll to approve the May minutes with changes noted. Vote: 5 Ayes. Motion
carried.
3. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS
a. Three Rivers Park District: Commissioner Sara Wyatt from Three Rivers Park
District spoke to the Commission on projects in which they are involved in and
around Plymouth. These included a 36th Avenue pedestrian bridge over 169. They
partnered with the federal government with a 80-20 split on expenses. Chair Smith
asked who covered the 80%. Ms. Wyatt said it was the federal government. She
also spoke of the Medicine Lake Regional Trail project from Bass Lake Road to
County Road 47 starting this year. Also this year, is a project for a mini -putt golf
course at Eagle Lake. It is an18 hole accessible course, which should appeal to all
ages. The accessible portion is 9 holes. It will be completed in September. The last
link of the Luce Line Regional Trail connecting to Theodore Wirth Park is being
completed. There is an off -leash dog area at Fish Lake Regional Park. Bassett
Creek Regional Trail will connect French Regional Park to Theodore Wirth Park.
Dakota Rail Regional Trail is now open from Wayzata to St. Bonifacius. She
thanked the Commission for all the collaborations we have had and looks forward to
more in the future. Chair Smith also thanked her for the collaborations.
b. Staff . Dan Lauer explained that he works mainly with athletic programs. April had
a big kick-off for adult softball, with about 100 teams in the summer and 50 teams in
the fall. Youth athletics also started up in April. Lauer works with the high school
athletic directors for scheduling fields. In May, soccer, rugby, and ultimate frisbee
groups started up. Summer staff training is going on right now. A lot of programs
started this week and many more will start next week. Baseball has about 400 kids
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this year. He is offering about 40 camps this summer covering various sports. Our
soccer league program will start in the fall with about 900 kids. Special projects
coming up include Fire & Ice. He is also working on trail counting, setting the
counter out at various sights. Chair Smith asked about the trail counters. Dan
explained that they have laser beams across the trail to do the counting.
c. Staff. Superintendent of Recreation Diane Evans reported that on Tuesday, we
trained 80-90 seasonal staff who work at programs such as beaches, sports, puppet
wagon, day camp and others. Most of the programs start next week and run through
early to mid August. Beaches are officially open, with guards at Parkers Lake and
West Medicine Lake. The water level at Parkers Lake is a little low because of lack
of rain. Medicine Lake water level is OK. Chair Smith asked about safety with the
low water level. Evans replied that it shortens up the swimmable area and presents
a problem with weed growth. The concert series will start next week. There will be
three Wednesday Kids Koncerts, one each in June, July and August. Theater is
also offered, with a Shakespeare performance and the Prairie Fire Children's
Theater. Three water ski shows are offered in June, July and August, although the
June show may be cancelled because of low water. Music in Plymouth will be on
July 1 at 5:00 at the Hilde Center. The fire works are at 10:00. The Music in
Plymouth Fun Run is Saturday, June 27. The race starts at 8:00 a.m. Commissioner
Smith asked when the port -a -potties are put out. He noticed that they were not out
through Memorial Day weekend. Eric Blank said it is a budget issue, but we could
look at adding them a little earlier. Lauer said the playfields do get them earlier.
Commissioner G. Anderson's bike event has been rescheduled to June 20 because
of rain. Commissioner G. Anderson mentioned that a port-a-pottie was torched at
East Medicine Lake Park and asked if the City bears the burden of cost for this.
Blank said we buy insurance for this, and we do lose 3-4 per year. Rolling Hills Park
lost a playground a couple of weeks ago. At Zachary Playfield, the perpetrators
moved a trash container to the building and set it on fire, where the fire climbed up
to the eaves of the building. Minnetonka and Plymouth had a series of fires this
spring. Minnetonka caught three young ladies last week. Perhaps they are
responsible for our fires too.
4. REPORT ON PAST COUNCIL ACTION
a. Authorized two scoreboards for Zachary Playfield: Eric Blank reported that
Plymouth/New Hope Little League requested two new scoreboards for Zachary
Playfield. They were under budget on their concession stand project. They bought
one scoreboard, and we bought one. Little League volunteers will do the installation.
5. UNFINISHED BUSINESS
a. Update — Greenway: Director Blank reported that we are in the process of
purchasing a six -acre parcel in Hampton Glen. It will go to the Council for approval
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at their second meeting in June. There is one more gap in the eastern part of the
Greenway. He expects to purchase 1-3 more parcels yet this year.
b. Youth Sports Facility Fees Policy: Director Blank explained the background and
how the Mayor's task force report from 1982 outlining the basic structure of the
facility policies has been our guide for last 27 years. Under the current economic
conditions, Council feels that we need to discuss the merits of having a user fee
much like the Ice Arena and Fieldhouse. We want to give the associations a one -
year's lead-time to prepare for this. Staff has done research of our needs,
schedules, and other cities' policies. We have at least 17 athletic associations in
our city. The logistics of managing field use is on a much larger scale than some of
the surrounding cities. The options we are considering are charging by hours, by
participants, and by games. We feel that the hours option is ultimately the most fair
because practices and games cause the same wear and tear. We are looking for a
system that doesn't overburden the administration of the programs and still offers
fairness. Our conclusion was that using the number of children would be the
simplest and easiest to understand for the first year. We would switch to the number
of hours in the future. We now give out blanket permits, but often the fields aren't
being used. We have, in the meantime, turned down other groups. If we switch to
an hourly basis, groups may be more careful and accurate, and there will be more
room for others. The cost of maintaining the fields now is at least $600,000.
Recouping $100,000 is a fair amount. We are talking about $2-3 per hour, which is
much lower than the costs of renting the Ice Arena or Fieldhouse. We would be
administering the fee — the associations can decide how to collect the fee.
Commissioner Smith asked if the need to push the fees to the users is an economy
issue or a fairness issue. Blank said the task force in 1982 felt extraordinary tasks
like lining could be charged. The school district charges fees for lining their fields.
We anticipate that we will have serious budget cuts. Some have asked if we will
have increased service. We could possibly have even less service if the budget cuts
are not enough. We do want safe fields. Just a few years ago, the City had 270 full
time employees. As of Jan 2010, we will be down to 240 full time employees. Other
line items may also be down -sized. The City Manager wants us to think about
resizing government. Commissioner Carroll asked to what extent would
associations be expected to contribute. Blank said that $100,000 would keep us
going.
Commissioner Carroll asked about the history of the dome. Blank explained that it
opened in the fall of 1999. The capital came out of revenue bonds. It is an
enterprise fund. Operation is 100% paid for by users. In fact, it made $130,000 in
profit this past season. All expenses are charged to its budget. Commissioner
Carroll asked about contracts with the athletic associations. Blank said that they are
annual contracts for each year. Plymouth groups are booked first, then outside
groups. Councilmember Stein wanted to clarify that Plymouth does not get any state
local government aid. Commissioner Nelson said that he was surprised by the
soccer association saying that the fields are not in as good of shape as they used to
be and if there is less money, will it become worse. Dan Lauer said some fields are
laid out where there is not irrigation and are affected by this, but most are still in
very good shape. He hasn't seen a big change over the years. If he hears about
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problems, he gets the maintenance staff to fix things. Eric Blank says our fields are
probably within the top third in the area. It has been said that if you play 40 soccer
games on a field, the field needs to be rebuilt. We play 300 games on fields every
year. Many groups use them, such as phy ed classes, school teams and soccer
associations. The fields get no rest, no time off for recovery. Only artificial turf could
be kept in perfect shape. Lauer pointed out that multi use fields previously to
provided for soccer and football. Now they also are used by rugby, lacrosse, and
ultimate frisbee. Commissioner Carroll said his daughters are soccer players, and
he spends a lot of time at Elm Creek, which is generally in excellent condition.
Commissioner Nelson felt that some sort of fee will definitely be needed. He
coaches for Plymouth New Hope Little League, and many of those kids never play
in Plymouth. He also wanted to know how long the fee would be in effect. Blank
said we are working on two-year budgets and will reevaluate after that. Even if we
used a per child fee, the associations could determine how they would collect.
Commissioner Carroll asked how we permit to the associations. Blank replied that
we permit to the parent organization. Commissioner Knight asked about how we
were coming up to $100,000. Blank said we worked it out so it would come out to
that total. Knight asked what is most important - fairness issues or administrative
issues. Blank said fairness would probably be most important. Blank also pointed
out that we have more non-resident participants than most cities. The issue is: do
the associations have carte blanche to bring in non-residents? Commissioner
Nelson said it makes sense that we are friendly to other cities. Chair Smith asked if
we could start the per hour option now. Diane Evans said that we have the ability,
but do the associations have the ability? Starting with the per -participant fee was
meant to simplify for them for the first year so they have time to figure out how they
want to handle it. Blank said we could do the hourly the first year. There probably
would be some errors and omissions. Commissioner Carroll asked when we would
calculate the number of participants, because the number floats a bit. Lauer said we
most likely we would use the numbers from the previous year. Those numbers are
solid. It would be very difficult to do it for the current year. Lauer said there is a
history of what they have used the previous years. Commissioner Carroll asked if
we have plans to audit the participant numbers. Lauer said it is on an honor system.
Commissioner G. Anderson asked about comparison of cost for per hours and per
child and how it can vary. How will it affect the associations? Lauer said each
association submitted what they would like to see for fees. Chair Smith asked if staff
still feels we should start with the per child fee rather than per hour. Evans said she
feels we should go with a consensus of the associations and whether they can
handle it. Blank said that staff feels the hourly rate is the best in the long run. Chair
Smith said he feels the hourly fee is the most fair. Commissioners Nelson and
Knight agreed.
MOTION: Commissioner Nelson moved to approve instituting an hourly fee for
association use of fields. Commissioner Knight seconded. Vote: 5 Ayes.
Director Blank pointed out that this would be for 2010 and 2011. All associations
were invited to come to this meeting and to send letters. They will now be informed
as to what the commission has decided. We have submitted $300,000 in
department cuts for the new budget. City Council will schedule work sessions with
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staff. Council will have a lot of work to do in reviewing these issues. There will be
more opportunity for associations to talk to the Council. The budget will be finalized
in December.
c. Recommend 2009 Trail Project Blank reviewed what he had presented at the last
meeting. Staff is recommending the Bass Lake project, and the vote was tabled last
time. Chair Smith said he was originally pushing for the Dunkirk to Vicksburg trail,
but Blank had showed him that it was now in the CIP for 2010. He had visited the
site of the Bass Lake Trail and is now leaning towards it. Commissioner Nelson also
went out and looked at the site and agrees with the need for it. Commissioner G.
Anderson feels the same way, and he likes to see paving on both sides of a major
county road. Chair Smith asked if the project is stopping at the neighborhood or the
convenience store. Blank said it depends on how far the budget will take it. Smith
felt it would be good to go to the store as a convenience to the neighborhood and as
a cost savings in the long run. Bob Erickson, who lives at 10552 57th Avenue N,
spoke to the Commission. He said he understands that the trail would be on the
south side of Bass Lake Road between Zachary and Trenton, and he is in favor of
it. He feels it would be a nice addition. Chair Smith asked how he felt about
continuing it to the store. Mr. Erickson thought that would be a benefit because he
could walk to the store.
MOTION: Chair Smith brought back the tabled motion from May 14 where
Commissioner D. Anderson moved to approve the completion of the trail segment
on Bass Lake Road, and Commissioner Vanderwall seconded. He added an
amendment to continue the trail to Nathan Lane if possible. Vote: 5 AYES.
Director Blank pointed out that the issue will go to Council at their second meeting
in June.
6. NEW BUSINESS
a. Plymouth Creek Center and Fieldhouse Fees: Rick Busch reported on the
Fieldhouse. We have done very well over the years, escrowing money for
replacement of the dome when needed. There are 8-10 similar facilities in the metro
area now, and our fees are among the lowest. We have been using a 3 year cycle
for setting rates, and we have one more year in that cycle. He would like to hold the
fees where they are right now. However, he would like to look at non-resident fees.
In fairness to Plymouth resident groups, he would like to keep their fees the same.
Resident groups would consist of half Plymouth residents, or a Plymouth company,
school, or church. For non-resident groups, we would add $20 per hour for the full
field and $10 for a half field. This would bring in approximately $10,000 in the
coming year. It also gives the Plymouth groups something extra for their tax dollar.
We have open play time during the day on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday for 2-3
hours in the morning for preschool and home school children at a cost of $2 each.
Afternoon open play for the older kids also costs $2 per child. Open play started in
2001 and was slowly growing. With the addition of inflatables, it has become hugely
popular. We propose to keep resident fees at $2, and increase non-resident fees to
3. We are projecting approximately $2,000 in additional revenue. Commissioner
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Carroll noticed that the rental rates are not even numbers. Would it be easier
administratively to even it up? Busch said it really isn't a problem. Commissioner
Knight asked if we should ask for more of an increase since we don't move it up for
3 years. Chair Smith commented that $2 or $3 is a great bargain. Maple Grove
charges $4 and $5 and they don't have as much to offer. He suggested offering a
punch card. Commissioner Knight agreed that it is a great deal. Busch agreed that it
is a great perk for the residents. We charged $1 for walking on the track at first, but
Council decided it was such a great item for the residents, that we made it free. We
are trying to get as many people using it during the day as possible. Blank
mentioned that during these economic times, this is something small we can afford
to offer for the community.
MOTION: Commissioner Carroll moved to approve a rate increase for use of the
Fieldhouse for open play times by non-residents based on staff recommendations.
Commissioner Nelson seconded. VOTE: 5 Ayes.
Rick Busch said it is a little more complicated to set fees for the Activity Center and
Millennium Garden. People can rent up to 18 months in the future. The changes he
is recommending today are for 2011-2012. We are proposing increasing Plymouth
Room rates for the Activity Center by 5%. It is heavily booked, mostly weddings, but
also bar mitzvahs, company parties and anniversaries. We get more requests than
we can handle. Meeting rooms are used mostly for recreation programs, senior
clubs, and community groups. For the Millennium Garden, there is not much
competition. There are a few facilities around the area, and our fees are within
range, maybe a little low. He thinks that 5% would be a good rental increase.
Commissioner Carroll asked what the demand level is for the meeting rooms. Busch
replied that it is very heavy, and we have trouble accommodating them all. We book
senior and recreation programs first before community groups. Blank said that it is
mostly homeowners' associations who are using the rooms. Busch said we
average around 700 hours of non-profit group use. Blank said maybe we could
charge a fee like $10 or so. Commissioner G. Anderson asked why there is a
different rate for Plymouth corporations. Evans said businesses have additional
financial resources available. Commissioner Carroll thought the corporate rates
were rather modest.
MOTION: Commissioner G. Anderson moved to approve an increase in fees for
the Plymouth Creek Center and Millennium Garden starting in 2011. Commissioner
Knight seconded. VOTE: 5 AYES.
b. Review Draft of 2010-2014 CIP. Blank explained that we are in the middle of a
complete financial software update. The budget portion has not been installed yet,
so the CIP document is in a draft form. He explained some of the highlights of the
CIP, including $375,000 for trails, which would accommodate the trail from Dunkirk
to Vicksburg. The park dedication fees typically bring in over a million dollars per
year. This year we are at $0, and the park dedication fund is low. For land
acquisition, we are using the money remaining on bonds we had sold. We do apply
for grants, but we need to have money in the CIP in order to qualify for the grants.
We are proposing to complete the Hilde improvement project in 2010. A trail
crossing at Cheshire Lane is included. The future of the West Medicine Lake Park
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building is based on what is going to happen with Pilgrim Lane Elementary. A skate
park at the water treatment plant is listed, as well as replacement of an outdoor
hockey rink. A small dog area at the dog park is scheduled to be fenced in. At
Oakwood and Lacompte, we plan to install higher fencing. The first phase of the
Northwest Greenway could be available for construction in 2011. Three Rivers Park
Disctrict is planning a bridge over Northwest Boulevard for the Luce Line.
Chair Smith asked about the trail planning in 2010 and construction in 2011 and
where the construction costs would come from. Blank said he is hoping that income
will be coming into the park dedication fund, and we will be able to proceed. It will
be easier on the homeowners the sooner we build the trail to avoid having them feel
disrupted by any new construction. Commissioner Carroll asked about the window
of opportunity for acquiring federal stimulus money for the bridge over Northwest
Boulevard. Blank said the Planning Department watches for these opportunities and
keeps us informed.
7. COMMISSION PRESENTATION: None
8. STAFF COMMUNICATION: None
9. ADJOURNMENT
Chair Smith entertained the motion to adjourn. MOTION was made by Commissioner
G. Anderson and seconded by Chair Smith. Vote: 5 Ayes. Motion approved. The
meeting adjourned at 9:05 p.m.
The next meeting will be a park tour on July 9, 2009.
Donna Sankey — PRAC recorder