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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPark and Recreation Advisory Commission Minutes 05-08-2003MINUTES OF THE PARK AND RECREATION ADVISORY COMMISSION MEETING May 8, 2003 Page 17 Present: Commissioners Anderson, Aamoth, Fiemann, Meyer, Rezabek, Singer; staff Abel, Blank, Evans, Pederson Absent: Commissioner Krahulec 1. CALL TO ORDER Chair Anderson called the meeting to order at 7 p.m. in the Council Chambers. 2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES It was moved by Singer and seconded by Rezabek to approve the minutes of the April meeting. Motion carried, all ayes. 3. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS a. Athletic Associations. Representatives were present to discuss Item 6a. b. Staff. Evans talked about how much our electronic registration had increased since the last registration period. Evans then discussed the success of the Yard and Garden Expo. There were 50 paid vendors and 15 non-profit vendors. Last year there were only 30 overall vendors. This shows a substantial increase. About 1,400 people attended the Expo. Evans has also been working on the History Fest, which began Thursday, May 8, with School Days. The general public event will be Saturday, the 10th. There are approximately 1,600 students attending this year's History Fest School Days. Primavera was held in mid-April. Over 800 people attended the event. The event included a poetry slam this year, which was well received. Evans mentioned that we are a finalist for the Gold Medal Award. She's working on the 12 -minute video that needs to be sent in next in order for us to be considered. We also applied for the Sports Illustrated award, which we hope to hear about in the next couple of months. Sports Illustrated is recognizing 10 cities in each state and then picking the top one excelling in sports. If we win, we would be featured in the magazine. We are working on the Millennium Garden grand opening. We've been coordinating with the Plymouth Civic League on a matching promotion for Music in Plymouth and the garden grand opening. Evans displayed the 2003 Music in Plymouth poster. We hope to use the rose from the Music in Plymouth poster in the Millennium Garden promotional piece. Anderson was impressed with the article in the Sailor about Plymouth being a finalist for the Gold Medal Award. Fiemann asked about the next step after we submit the video. Evans said we wouldn't hear until the PRAC Minutes/May 2003 Page 18 national conference in October. She said it's fairly typical that a city doesn't win on its first try, but she's hoping we will be the exception. c. Others. 4. REPORT ON PAST COUNCIL ACTION There was no past Council action to report. 5. UNFINISHED BUSINESS a. Skate park update. Blank explained that the church decided not to enter into a lease agreement with the City. We have been looking at other options. We may have found another location within Zachary Playfield for the skate park, but not the BMX course. It would be under the water tower in Zachary Playfield. Funding is available. Some underbrush may have to be cut to make it a little more visible. Blank said $115,000 has been budgeted for this project. Fiemann agrees we need a skate park on the east side of town. FIEMANN MOVED AND REZABEK SECONDED A MOTION THAT THE CITY PROCEED WITH THE SKATE PARK ON THE EAST SIDE OF PLYMOUTH IF A SUITABLE LOCATION IS FOUND. MOTION CARRIED, AYES ALL. Rezabek mentioned the indoor skate park on the west side of Plymouth west of Rainbow. b. Tobacco free parks update. Blank stated that we are anticipating a work- study session with the Council in the near future where this topic will be discussed. Following that study session, at Council direction, the Park Commission may then draft some type of ordinance. The Tobacco Free Youth Advisory Group is working with the City Manager to come up with a date to make a presentation to the Council. Singer cannot attend the next study session meeting, but will forward a letter expressing her feelings on this subject to Blank. c. Gold Medal award update. Blank said that staff has requested that Singer be in the video, and she accepted. We have reviewed videos of half a dozen other cities. We must get that final part of the application package delivered by the 26th or 27th of May. d. Dog park update. Blank said that work crews have completed the 300 feet of boardwalk. The dog park should open in mid-June. We have had one neighbor who is against it, because she boards horses and has used this area in the past to exercise the horses, even though this was not a legal use of the property. We will now sign the site No Horses, but will try to find another area where she can continue to exercise them. 6. NEW BUSINESS a. Ice Center - review need for third sheet (referred from Council). Blank reviewed the process so far on this issue. The Council held its second study PRAC Minutes/May 2003 Page 19 session on this. They passed a motion directing that PRAC review the need for a third sheet. There will be another Council study session on this sometime in late June. This gives PRAC another meeting to discuss this further if necessary. Blank discussed the materials that had been included in the agenda packet. Although Providence Academy did not attend the meeting, they had sent a letter to Blank, outlining their needs for ice time and their financial pledge of $1 million toward a third sheet. The Figure Skating Club was invited to attend, but they are very busy with their spring skating show coming up this weekend, and tonight was their dress rehearsal. Abel distributed a handout showing what typically goes on at the Ice Center during an ordinary week in January. Wayzata Youth Hockey is the major user of the Ice Center. We are also home to the Wayzata and Armstrong high school Varsity and Jr. Varsity teams, who practice and hold games there. The Plymouth Pandas run their practices at the Ice Center as well. Abel feels that the Pandas' membership will double in the next few years. They currently have 90 members. He said the largest complaint he gets now is that there isn't enough public open skating. The schedule showed how Rink A & B are used, and a proposed scenario for Rink C. It also showed the addition of roughly 72 hours of ice time. With the oncoming of Providence Academy, we will have much larger numbers using our ice than Bloomington and Edina, who both have three ice sheets. There are a few weeks in the spring and the fall when things are slow, when the ice could be removed and then dry floor events could be held, Abel said. He feels he could keep three sheets running very efficiently from September through May. Singer asked if we could remove the ice on either of the two rinks we now have. Abel said yes, but we only do it for maintenance at this point. Rink A is the Olympic rink and has a sand base. Rink B has a concrete floor and is professional size. Abel stated that his preference for proposed rink C would also be a concrete base and would be professional size. More often it is the Olympic sheet that is requested in the summer, Abel said. Singer asked about the sizes of Edina and Bloomington rinks. Blank said that Bloomington has one Olympic and two professional rinks. Edina has three professional size rinks. Blank discussed another handout, which depicted other sports facilities that we operate and how many children participate in the various sports. Fiemann stated that he has recently been appointed to the Wayzata Hockey Board, and Rezabek said he is a hockey coach. Aamoth asked who might use the third sheet during off peak times. Blank said you could use it for something like a flea market, roller hockey, indoor soccer, etc. Fiemann said it is his understanding that a third sheet could be used 11 months out of the year. Anderson then opened the meeting for the public to make comments. Mark Brandt, a representative from Wayzata Youth Hockey, stated he's been the ice scheduler for them for the last five years. They put 60 kids on a sheet at one time, but they like to keep it under 30 kids to a sheet. They PRAC Minutes/May 2003 Page 20 also have to use hours that are not very popular with parents. They begin practice at 6:30 a.m. They are forced to buy ice elsewhere during ice times that are less than desirable. Outdoor ice time is not an option very often due to weather extremes. He fully supports the addition of a third sheet. John Wellman, Wayzata Hockey Board member, said that he works with the C league. It's for the kids that don't want to play four or five times a week. It has 141 kids in it this year. He thinks this program is going to continue to grow. He supports another sheet of ice and believes the facility would be busy at all times. Greg Gibson, President of Wayzata Youth Hockey, discussed how the program is growing - there were 100 girls completely new to the program this year. He said they'd like to offer a mite team for girls only. They are also looking at adding several new travel teams this year. They purchase ice at many other locations. They would use the ice sheet from October through March, and use any hours Providence doesn't use. In addition, they are looking for off-season training opportunities such as summer and fall camp programs, pre -season open skating, adult men's and women's leagues, etc. He talked about how competitive the C league program is. They host tournaments, which brings money in to the City of Plymouth. A third rink would allow larger tournaments with more teams. They have made a commitment to fund raise $500,000 at this time. Anderson and Meyer asked if anyone had come up with long-term figures for 10 years out. Gibson thinks these three sheets will be heavily used over the long term. People want to come to Plymouth for a number of reasons - we have a beautiful facility that is well run, and Wayzata Hockey has a large following. Aamoth asked about projection numbers - are they population based? Gibson said they are based on programs being currently offered and interest levels. Their goal is to keep kids involved. Any level of player has an opportunity to play in the Wayzata Youth Hockey league in some form or another, for example, a 14 year old who has never skated can join the C league. Gibson guaranteed that Wayzata Youth Hockey would buy all the ice time that Providence doesn't use. As a final comment, Gibson said he wholeheartedly supports adding a third sheet of ice. Singer complemented Gibson on his commitment, passion, etc. She said she understands that there is a need for another ice sheet, but her concern is for people who are losing their jobs and the current state of the economy. She said hockey is expensive, and some people may get to the point where they can't afford it. Gibson said they subsidize some of the program for the younger kids. A mite pays $95 per year to play. He feels that the commitment to hockey is stronger than ever. He thinks one of the things that attracts people to Plymouth are the fine amenities offered here. This includes the many youth sports opportunities. Fiemann asked Gibson to discuss the scholarship program. Gibson said they have an PRAC Minutes/May 2003 Page 21 annual golf outing where they raise $10,000 for scholarships. There is also an additional scholarship program that was established in memory of a former board member. Dean Pospesel has been involved in hockey for 37 years. He is very grateful for the support provided by the City of Plymouth decision makers. He had great praise for Bill Abel and how well he manages the Plymouth Ice Center. He played at Blake when he was 8 years old. They've done only minor updating to that facility, and it is still used today. Georgann Wenisch, a resident, has lived in this area since 1987. Her purpose in attending the meeting was to remind everyone that hockey is just a small portion of what Plymouth is about. She doesn't think this is the time to be doing this, considering the economy as it is now. Perhaps a tenth of the population of Plymouth is involved in hockey, and her feeling is that the City is not responsible for being the provider of every need for every person. She brought up problems such as parking, traffic congestion, and the impact on the wetlands. She urged PRAC and staff to look ahead 20 or 30 years. She grew up in Brooklyn Center. That city, as well as several others similar in size, has deteriorated over the years. She fears that this could happen in Plymouth. She wants PRAC to think about the families that don't have kids in hockey. This project has a $5 million dollar price tag. Even with the donations from Providence and Wayzata, who picks up the tab for the rest? She doesn't feel the taxpayer should be responsible. She stated that she is a hockey fan and agrees that the hockey associations do wonderful things for the kids of Plymouth. Bob Fallen, a representative from Armstrong Youth Hockey, stated that he supports a third sheet in Plymouth. He said that although their association is not as large as Wayzata's, they do have need for more ice time. Bloomington and Edina are recognized as a hub for hockey in the state of Minnesota. Hockey organizations are constantly looking for multi sheet facilities for running state and regional tournaments. He mentioned that Osseo -Maple Grove is one of the 10th largest hockey associations in the state, and they might also want to schedule ice time through Plymouth. Singer asked him how many kids are in the Armstrong program. He said they have 117 in the travel program and 120 in the mite program that do not travel. Anderson then asked commissioners for their views on the topic after hearing what everyone had to say. Where do we want to go with this? Is there additional information needed? Meyer feels there is a need for a third sheet. But she is concerned about the financial aspects. Aamoth wants a better idea of expected participation rates for a third sheet. Meyer thinks the Wayzata High School might have good figures for 10 years from now. Blank stated that Plymouth has authorized the area north PRAC Minutes/May 2003 Page 22 and west of Vicksburg and Schmidt Lake Road to remain rural until 2020. We have 16 athletic associations that we deal with. Only one is Plymouth based and that's the Plymouth Soccer Association. All other athletic associations are determined by school district boundaries. The Wayzata School District would typically look at the growth within the district. There isn't an exact science for determining projected growth. New programs cannot form if there's no ice time for them to use, Blank said. We are charged to run the ice arena. This is a business, and it must be profitable. Blank said that he and Abel projected about 1,500 hours of ice time on a third sheet could be sold during the months of October -March. There is also a possibility that additional hours would be needed during other months throughout the year. If we sell 1,000 hours of ice at any time, it becomes a better financial model, Blank said. If the ice rink fails, it falls back on the taxpayers. The risk of financial failure decreases with a third sheet of ice. A third sheet will make us more profitable. Singer knows there is a demand for a third sheet. She is very concerned about being fiscally responsible, however. Singer has been at both study sessions and she feels she has enough information to make a decision. She supports more recreational use and public use of the ice arena. Rezabek agrees there is a need for a third sheet as well, and he thinks the Council needs to make a commitment now. Meyer also supports the addition of another sheet and recommends that the City Council look at options for helping to fund it. Fiemann also stated his concern about the finances, and indicated his support for a third sheet. The Council is the determining body as to whether or not there is money for this project. Fiemann said he loves it when he and his son have an opportunity to skate outdoors. But the window for outdoor skating is very short. Either it's too cold or there's an inch of water on the ice. He's also involved in the mite program. Of 370 mites, 35 were girls. An all -girls program would be very popular, Fiemann said. By second grade, girls do not want to play hockey with boys. Fiemann said that PRAC needs to rely on the Council to see if it's fiscally possible to do this. Singer asked Abel about the Pandas Skating Club and what his sense is of their growth. Abel said they have about 90 members right now in the Pandas. They are the advanced skaters. In addition, we have 600 kids in the Learn to Skate program. They're running out of ice time. He foresees the Pandas doubling their membership in the next three years. Singer asked if there is a formula for selling ice time? Blank said that when the arena opened the Council passed certain operational policies. Everything is based on priorities - first priority goes to City public programs, the second priority is to the school districts, Wayzata Hockey is the third priority, all other youth organizations in Plymouth are fourth priority, Plymouth adult groups are the fifth priority, and then non -Plymouth groups would be the last priority. Blank said we barely get past the third priority, and available ice time is sold out. Singer asked if we could address those PRAC Minutes/May 2003 Page 23 priorities and offer more to recreational users? Blank said there's another factor and that's the number of Plymouth kids in the various programs, and from that we use a ratio. Aamoth had additional questions about the projected long-term use of an additional ice sheet. Rezabek offered to help Aamoth with this question. Anderson agrees there is a demonstrated need for a third sheet. REZABEK MOVED THAT PRAC FINDS THERE IS A NEED FOR A THIRD SHEET OF ICE AND THAT THE CITY COUNCIL BE ASKED TO ADDRESS THE FINANCIAL MATTERS. MOTION SECONDED BY MEYERS. SINGER AMENDED THE MOTION TO ADD THAT THE MINUTES OF THIS MEETING BE FORWARDED TO THE CITY COUNCIL. MOTION CARRIED WITH FIVE AYES. FIEMANN ABSTAINED, BECAUSE HE IS ON THE WAYZATA HOCKEY BOARD OF DIRECTORS. 7. COMMISSION PRESENTATION Singer asked about the sailing group and if we'd heard anything from them. They have made arrangements with Three Rivers Park District and seem to be happy with the deal, Blank said. 8. STAFF COMMUNICATION The next meeting will be June 12. The July meeting will probably be at the Plymouth Creek Center. 9. ADJOURN The meeting adjourned at 8:55 p.m.