HomeMy WebLinkAboutPlanning Commission Minutes 12-04-1985CITY (If PLYHOUITH"
PLANNING OWISSIO MINUTES
DECEMBER 47, 1,985.
The r pular Meetlnc Of the Plymouth Planning was
cal leo ttj order at P.14.
M-
S p SMT. C tia1rmatx S tt11 erwaId Commissioners
Wire, Md9nus, Stu-lberg, pldfka, Mellen
and Pauba=
M . ERSASSENT.- None
R tT- ommunity Development `ccrdioatcr
Sara Mc tern
City Engineer Sherpa Goldberg;
Community Development Secretary;
Grace Winema.n
CONSENT ACr0A AND
jNUTF_S.
MOTION uy Commissioner 1.5ttilherg, seconded by Cowin ssicner RUTES OF OVE- R
Magnusnus to recommend approval of the November ZO, 1985
141nutes as submitted
VOTE 6 Ayes. Commissioner Wire abstained. POTION carried. VOTE - MOTTOCARRIED
PUBLIC WAKING
Chairman Stelqerwald introduced the request by Holiday HOLIDAY STATIONSTORES
tat icnstcres y Inc. and requested an overview of the Novem- INC., - SITE FLAN AND
ber Z ''y, 1985 staff report by Coordinator McConnt Chairman CONOTUMAL USE
t elgerwal d int.) uc od lir, Dave Hceschen, Holiday tat <lon- PERHIT WN0Wt4T
stores, Inc* and Robert Byers, Short-lllctt-Henderson, 85088)
Inc. who prepared the traffic surveyx He inquired when the
traffic survey , was done; time of day; and, weather con-
ditions. Mr. Byers responded that the report is based on
noon arid evening hours where the most activity occurs durincl
the week. The survey was done in late October, the roadways
were clear..
Commissioner ;
Pale 270
1, 'L' CoO lssion Minutes
December 4, _ 1985
Mr. Hers st1:, ted that it is difficult to enforoeenforceparking and
E driving restrictions with signage.
Coni si.oner Plufkd suggested that the personnel, at the pa
station control the parking in the lay -pa" aisles. Mr.
Hoeschen stated that from a retail point of view. the would
prefer` not to b in the position c dictating,to the c ostota"
ers. Commissioner Pluf a understood this position but
x `t ae customersr aretsametedtheaRac€ ul e more l x i lad c st m , who .
tr i.ncl to get in and out of the facility to buy gas.
Chaj.r. ielqerivald stated h -pass aisles are o con-
cern an(,, tt,4at adding the pumps will acid to the traffic and
cust,)m r f ru*.trat i, on. Commissioner Plu ka coneurred, stat -
Ing that there is adequate space to pump the gasp but cars
parked if4 *;he aisles will cause problems.
Co.mmissioner Mdgnus steed that the station should be re-
designed and the door to the store area be relocated to
diminish the problem cif cars parking in thr by-pass lanes.
Chairman S eigetwa d Inquired if the plicant ncur with
tondition No.. 5 that prohibits outside storage and display
of mer ,handise. lir. Heschen answered affirmatively. Com-
missioner Wire commented that he has noticed outside storage
of merchandise at other facilities. Mr. Hoeschen stated it
Is their Intent to reduce this at the other fac l,ltie3; and,
it is to their advantage;to, have no outside storage or mer-
chandise display at this station.
Commissioner Magnus inquired If they had considered another
type of gasoline dispenser. fir.. Hoeschen stated they do use
trio t,,`.pes of dispen erst but it necessary from a corporate
standpoint to Install the: same type of' dispensers at all
their facilities. 1
1
Chairman: Steig rwald opened the Public Hearing. I
i
Cobert Foster, 10717 10th Avenue Horth, stated he owns the
mobile hods park nearby and is a frequent customer at the
station. He agrees with the addition tine two,-las Pumps.
Lhai.rman Steigerwald closed the Public Hearing.
MOTIO i by Commissioner Stulberg, seconded by Commissioner NOTIORTOAPPROVE
Mellen to recommend approval -dor the Site Pl.anj Conditional
Use Permit Amendment and Variances for Holiday Station -
stores, Inc. subject to the conditions as stated in the
November IL91 1985 staff report«
Page
Planning Commission Minutes
December 4, 1985
Conn, isoner Stulberg stated that the additionion of the trio
pumps will improve the circulation toeater handle the
customerr t taffi and will fess stacking, problems.
Commissioner Mellen concurred.
MOTION by Commissioner Plu'rka seconded byom"t sioner We MOTION T0. 9-0D
to Amend the Motion that ?*fore the City Council. ` reviews the
ap tl. iel t; ionr :staff review a siqnaqe plan tha* conforms to
the traffic study for vehicle direction anti to alert the
drivers to keep the by-pass aisles clear,
issioner Ware reiterated the condition of approval to
strc$s that theco shall be no merchandise stored outside*
Rall Call. Vote on the Amendment, Commissioner Mellen, Nayi. VOTE AMif
Ayes. MOTION carried.. MOTION CARRIED
Commissioner t a nus stated hi.. cannot support the recommenda-
tion, for approval because the plan over-extends tate use of
the property, and, there; are other alternatives to provide
good traffic exro,rletron. Tne addition of the gas pumps
will make It more difficult to visit the facility and there
are other dispensing systems that could he used. .along with
the redesign of tete building.
MOTXONRollCallVoteonlashMotionasonceAmended. Commissioner VOTE_ TN
tfiagnus Nay. Ayes MOTION carried. MOTION CARRIED
hairman Stelgerwald introduced the application by Soanticon S A TICON CORP,
Corporation and.. Prudential, Insurance Company. He requested AND, Pail TIAL
an overview of the November 25, 1985 staff report by Coord-w INSURANCE CO. .
Inator McAConn, WOO, FINAL PLAN,
STF. j: ^..
Chairman Stelgertval.d introduced Mr. Glen Sohostak, Prince- CONDITIONAL U$
ton, .3.,, representing oantr.00n Corporation, and, 14r., PERMIT .W VARIANCE
Nil-.s Lindberg, BMW Architects. Mr. Sohostak provided a
slide presentation of the facility In New Jersey, _ nd a
s,,imma-y of the proposal.
t.,irman Stei er ald inquired if they agree w.-th the content
of the consulting engineers' traffic analysis. Mr. Lindberq
stated they agree with Numbers I and 2 . er, atom and, regard-
ing the points in number three, they can work with them on
appropriate striping.
Chairman Steigerwald inquired whether there was agreement
re ardl"Q the signage as addressed by ;-gaff. Mr. Lindberg
answered affirmatively.
Chairman Stelgersval.d opened the Public Nearing, as there was
no one present to sp ok on this item, the Public Nearing was
page° 277,
Planning Commission l irlut
December 4t 1985
o missioner Wire stated his oncern regarding the signage
in that the "Flagship" fl°jrldinq has signage approved for a
location on 1-494 and if every t*nantcomes in with a re-
quest for signd e on 41 tho' si. nage will lose Its visibil-
ity and
isi "ail-
aad the aamhrof asth;tical
displeasing.
C ord* ator 'MoConn explained teat the sign approved for the
1-494 loci ion ihows only the 3034, C4mpus lir ve addresst
t ece (arse no tenant names. Commissiontv Wi r, he is
still cortcernedr that this will not be the lxa,., rpqu est for
signage at this location. Co mmissionet- Plufka statedlie
doesntt foresee there will he many more r,)quests for signage
nni 494. Commissioner Pauha sono rrY d #'tat infi he does not
sir# a proliferation of signs` that id tific<at-i n is impor-
tant
apor-
taut `or the facility- ands if the sign 15 in good taste
there should he no problem.
Commi3sloner Wire inquired if the sign is necessary because
they clent+l for the facility gilt arrive by plane and he
transported to the facility. fir. cho to . stated that their
marketing reports chow that 0 of the conference business
will originate with local companies from the Twin City
area.. Their research has shown that people want clear
directions on how to get' to the facility. Also, them c *a-
Cept oaf seclusion does not gave the building rt el'k visibil-
ity, so signage is .seeded. Commissioner Wire inquired how
the Sign Mould look. Mr. Lindberg stated the signage has
not beer, ddsignedt but wilt have ,limited verbiqe possibly
u inq only the words canti br.l nnea nl i s Conference
Center".
iommissinner Wire inquired about transient customers and
their plans for offering weekendken puck" e . Pir. Schostak
stated there avdul,d be weekend packages offered. ommi s-
sioner Wire inquired if the rates would be less than those
charged for the conference stays. fir, Sehostak stated this
would be the case. Commissioner Wire confirmed that 5centi-
con w auld not, advertise rates ort their sign. ommxssroner
plufka inquired if the restaurants associated to the center
would require additional siq nage? Mr . Schosta" stated that
this Ylould slot be the ;ase. Advertising the restaurants
would be low key through arts pla . e d in ,local newspapers. rs. He
added that because of the type of facIli.ty it wilt be, here
is no heed to bring customers in off the street.
Commissioner Wire inquired about the rereadv,;x1 and health
facility and if Scanticon and Prudential would be: the sole
operator. Mr. Schostak stated this is the case ind that
cantidon is the management company for every .` a,n wit;ai.n
the facility. Commission Wire inquired about w :end use of
Page 27
Planning Cofwiis5ion Minutes
e em er 1 I
n fae i l i `t jes and whether he campusarecreational
empioyees' families will ho, able to use the facilities.
Mr. Schostak stated the recreational facilities will he
Integral to the Northwestest Flushness Campus and they do not
want to alienate* the tenants However, it will be best to
have them, use the faeillties on a limited membership halls
The facility is mainly for the clients of Scanticon. Com-
missicRnor Wire Inquired if they would sell memberships.
Mr. Sc,t3stak explained it would not to that open and$ Mould
be by re,-erva0 on only.
Chairman Steigerwald inquired about the height of toe lodq-
inq tinct of the butl.(.tnq lir. Lindberg stated the parapet
of the t floor Mould be at the third floor of the "F°laq-
ship" building.
MOTION by obi-Assioner Paubaseconded by Chairman MOTION TO APPROVE
teigerwald to *eco mend approval for the MPUD Final Plan,
Site Plan, Conditional. Use permit] and ,Variance for "Scanti-
0 s:Ylj subject to the conditions as stated in the November
5, 1985 staff report*
Commissioner Pauba stated that it is an eXciting faor lity
and will be gocd for the City of Plymouth.
CARRIEDRollCalltote. 7 Ayes. MOTION carried. VOTE MOTION
N.'Maft ateigerwal,d int.oduced tete anp.licatlon and re- ST. MARYIS OF THE
quested an overview of the November 19, 1985 staff report by LAKE C Cly
Coordinator JlJC_ q. PRELIMINAR, Y ,FLAT
Chairman Stelgerwald introduced Mr, Greg F"rankj McComb ,
houtson Assoeiatest represenV7M9 the iet1ttoner,, Mr. F'r
ave the history of the property noting that the church < is
platting the property for four single family residential
lots; a lot for the church; ands a ,lot for public parkland.
Commissioner Pauba inquired if the church will retain owner --
ship of the residential lots. Mr. Frank stated the church
will sell the lots to individual home bW1d yrs.
Chairman Steigerwald opened the Publie Heirinq.
Theodore K. A3 0), 114 Forestview Lane N, stated he lives
across from the Chun exp and it Is his opinion that the
proposed single family units tell be built on the horst
possible land area of the plat. He explaineJ that he and
other neighbors have severe water and drainap problems on
the I r property and development of this property will COM-
pound their problems., He stated the proposed 1ooat1nn of
page
Planning Co mts lo4 t4inutes
ecembei. 4, 1985
e us for the individual homes-, andthy. ,..° leave no "'..c r ' " s ,
qr di.ng and cl.e rrnq M.- land will impact other homes in the
area with exo.ess dr-aina.l . He stated the pity has been do-
ing work in the area which alio increased the eater levels.
Art Cannons 216 Forestview, net r c eo with Mrs nd
noted that the drainage flow is from the pond into the creek
across the subject property to County Road 15. Chairman
teigerwalu Inquired about the problems with the culvert.
Mr. Cannan stated be has no problem with excess drainage at
his home as his sump pwrip takes care of this. He stated his
concern Ifs for the tN- ldl l e in this undeveloped area where
they have seen geese and pheasa its. He stated he . has re-
viewed the plat and the placement of the proposed .lots Mndr-
eate to him that there will he fill placed in the pend and
the wildlife area will be destroyed.
Mr. Frank stated the t, 1, vati ri of the ` pond will remain the
sameo, that some dredging will he accomplished with a small
amount of fill to provide compensating storage volumes.
Mr. Cannon Inquired if at, etivirohmental study will he dons:
arid., whetherr the residentsis can request 'that one be done'
Cuord-*; gator MoCoon explained that this develo.nm nt does not
exceed any of the thees holds so on environmental study` is
not be mandatory. She further ex alai e-ri that the residents
must make request for study , through the Fnvironmerital
Quality Board (EQB).
Mr. Cannon stated he bought his home because of the pondinq ,
and he doesn't want to see it destroyed.
Mr. Ane stated his cc-nc rn about the removal of brush and
vegetation that will increase ttae level of the pond and
wa ter log Cuordihator 11,,Conn explained the Storm Water
Drainage Man and ponding requirements; and,; that these
c loulatiohs tike into consideration full development o
this land.
Cha,a,rmin Stelgerwald confirmed with CoordInator McCann that
the ffenntnq development has contributed to the problems In
this area. He ext,ralned that, this development has had prob-
lems with Installing, their drainage system.
Mr. Cannon Inquired if the storm sever system is it.4,talled
before any homes? Coordinator 'McConn stated that this Is a
dual, process for de el.op lent o the property. She explained
the provisions of the Development Contrae s f which require
financial guar me s fsr the completion of drainage ar"d
utility s sttsM. Guarantees are also required to assure
installation and maintenance o° erosion control methods.
City "n--Oneer Co.ldherq stated the City his looked at the
a e 2
Planning Commission Minutes
December 4f 1985
draioa , systems from Highway 12, County Road 15f and High-
way where there are some culverts that need improvements.
Mr.. Cannon Inclu . ed if there ban been any thought given to
flip-flopping" the development areas to allow the wildlife
pondinq area to remain as it exists, tod v, Coordinator
McConn explained requirements of the Co4rehensi e Pari
Plan. e identified those ;areas subject tc pondin ease-
ments w ch cannot be. develapeu It was explained the
church nets credit for only that land Which vs at or above
the High eater Elevation.
Mr. Can -on, inquired ibout the value of the homes to be cort-
struet d, Cha4rman tei erwa' ` Kolained that the City does
not require the developer to P-iarantoe home valU(-$* Mr,
Frank stated that the 'vhurch will sellthe lots to individ-
uals who wil have homes constructed- the lots are larcle so
they would be similar to a more c>xpensive home.
TION by Commissioner Plu kar seconded by Comiiistsion `r NOTION TO APPROVE
Pauba to recommend approval of the Pr_Ilminar,y Plat for
Mary's of the Lake "-,ur hj sub pct to the conditions is
stated in the November 1V, 1985 Staff report
jRoq( !"
all to. es NOTION e rri d. von matim eARRirD
Chairman Steigerwald introduced the application by Glory of C, AY OF CHRIST
Christ Lutheran Church and requested an overview of the LUTHERAN C RCH
November 19, 1955 staff report by Coordinator icCorn.. ZONING ORDINANCE
AMENDMENT ` 120
Commissioner Maonus inquired about the reference to a vari-
ance in the last paragraph of correspondence submitted b
the church. Coordinator McConn explained this would not be
e:tsjble, Commissioner Magnus inquired about a Conditional
Use Permit. Coordinator McConn explained that the 0rdinance
prohibits c hvrehes In the F D Zoning District so that appli- ppli-
caationcationfor a Conditional Use Permit is not. allowable.
Chairman teiq rivald introduced Rev. J. Strohschttin, 1815
Shadyview Circlet who stated the land was purchased in 1982
and was a sound business decision. It is in an area ;the
church would like to serve which is accessible to the
congregation. He noted ;hat .nd costs prohibit the ch vch
from buying land in deveuoped areas of Plymouth*
Chairman Steigerwald stated the church purchased the lard `
two years after the Ordinance change. inquired if the
church representatives checked the lard use of the proper-
ty. Rev. Strohsch in stated, he, became pastor in June of
this year and is riot aware of what triehspi, ed in 11987»
Paw 270
r, anning Commission Minutes
em h 41 1985:
Commissioner Wire Inquired why the church would want to have
their church in a future Industrial drea., Rev. Strobschein
stated that this was not thought ` to be detrimental to the
church because It Mould be close to areas where people in
the congregation would work nd live; ands the size of the
parcel could buffer the church from industrial development.
Chairman Steigerwald opened the Public Hearing,
jr. Team. Sanson,, 18395 Highway $5, stated that rules and
t egul.at ons are needed but certainly can be changed. e
suggested certain things in the proposal by the church that
were not considered by City staff- such as the Fact that a
major hlohway is on one side of the church's property so
that prohibiting, developmentwould sept to be an error,
Chairman telgerwald t xplalned the t b A (Metropolitan urban
Service area), and USA (Community Urban Servide Area) and
that development cannot occa r because of constraints on
sever capacity.
Mr. Swanson stated that It is his opinion that FRO; (future
r rtricted development) is not zoning -- it's not anything
and various uses for the land should be considered by the
City, Coordinator MoConn explained that the FRO is a zoning
designation and the .property is quided 1p (planned indus-
trial). The Zoning Ordinance identifits allowable uses
within the FRO zoned areas.
Rev,. Strohschein stated he called other nel hbo,iiv)od
churches and surveyed their eater serier usea e. He stated
that in a.I cases single mil homes exceed Individual
churc4h , useape, He stated hecalled other churches who use
septic systems and wells and they have verified they operate
efficiently for their facilities.
Chal.-.,tan Ste1qerwald stated that the City's, concern with
pr$.vate systems is that, aoding to the building arse r
church aet vitles, such as a school) would be a bu:rde . ` to
that system and to the City's ability to provide police and
fire protection Commissioner pauba concurred.
Rev. Strobschein stated the City has control over, any pro-
posed expansion to the church facility, The area where the
church, would be built already qew poicce arta ire services
so that the church would be a problem as far as additional
coverage
ormytissioner Stulberg stated that this Ordinance change
would allow church construction In all FRa zoned areas which
would be a significant impact on ail. Clay services.
planning Commission Minutess
December ,,
tor* Swanson stated that the City should the Metro»
pt),litan outicil to allocate more sewer t apa ity to the
City. Chairman Steigerwald explained thel tv could be olt% cry
participation in ,uch a petition* however, the City must
abide by the Comprehensive Plan as approved.
Chairman Steigerwald closed tear Public Hearing.
Commissioneri,ssioner Plufka stated 'Iu questions the survsa.y taken by
the, petitioner sho wlnc sewage flow q n r d by a church
would be less than i single family r sid neo, Rev.
trohschol.n stated that he had talked with a representative
of McCombs -Knutson Associates <who ir,vestiqated why such high
useage awns designated For a church facility andit was e oc nd
that the peak flows on Sundays were used as the average.
Realistically, the church would not (jenorate this amount
City Engineer Goldberg explained that a septic system for a
church would need to be designed for the maximum usoaq . Mo
lalnod Further that the soils In this area Of PlynOUth
are not oo patiblo for septic systems. Rev,, Strohschoin
stated that It is his opinion that the acreaqe is large
enough to minimize any Impact from a septic system. City
Engineer Goldberg noted the'high cost of a septic system
where soils aro incompatible Rev. Strohschein stated the
cost would be their problem and they could absorb the Cost.
Chairman S ei,,jerwald inquired about the, church's tentative
time table for construction of the church, Rev* $trohschei
stated that at the earliest It would be next falll- they p-,°o-
pb e a 6,000 !,q. ft building which would serve a congrega-
tion
nqr c a -
tion of 600 Lo 700 members and could assure the. City they
would not expand until sewer is available.
Comml.sslon r Pluf%a reiteratedrated that. this Ordinance Amendment
would f e.,.t all the l~RD zoned land in Plymouth which would
substantially Impact vie City's services.
MOTION by Commissioner P auba j seconded by Commissioner NOTIO14 TO DENY
ulb rg to recommend denial of the 'Zoning Orainanc Amend-
mentl, stib ect to the reasons as stated '.n the November 196
1985 staff report; development of this land:' is premature and
opens the door to significant probl m as discussed by the
Commission.
Roll Call Vote. 7 Ayes. Motion carried. 'VOTE MOTTO CARRIED
Fags 278
111'anninq Commissionnutes,
a ce,nb e r 41, 198
OLJ 13USINESS
Chairman Steiqerwald introduced the application that was RAL DEVELOPMENT
heard by the Commission at 4 Public Hearinq bald on November KANWl TI SITE
1, 1985, a". which time the omr ion deferred the item for CONDITIONAL USE
modifications to the clans. leo dinq of the Nave her 1 , PERMIT AND VARIAHCE
1985 t report waived. FIELDFM604FIELDS
EPQ
rman Steiqerwald Introeuced Rob Fields,., representing the i`OR 'r -00-A WASH"
t t )i. Mfr. la *nod the mod.. '1.eation to the 05,109)
plans, for the crwash. The Commission inquxr (i about the
tentativeate the facility would be open forbusiness.,
1 4}psiieriyk drtingKi1'R k1 GM4}fi&ti1
con tru(.:tion in earty, 3anuary to be open for business in
March, 1986.
MOTION by Cc-mmissloner Stutberq,$, seconded 11 omm ssiOnc r 140TION TO APPROVE
P1:ufka$ ti) :#ecoo lend approval for the General Developmen,
Plan me-ndmi,- t Site n. Gond tion l Permit,. and
Variance for Bolo Fields and Brian Z ub rt f0jr. the
U-D o-'cIrwdsh'1,,'subject o Vie 00nditiO as tt :. in the
November 1911985 staff report.
Vote. 7 Ayes. MOTIOUMOTcarried. d. VOTE :14 T OH CARRIED
JNT
Th meeting adjourned at 10. t P.M.