HomeMy WebLinkAboutPlanning Commission Minutes 11-18-1970MINUIES Cr A REGULAR ,NMDgG OF
THE P.i..MNINIG CO3WISSION
PLYNDU TI, MILAN- R) A
NQVDIBI R 18, 1070
A ragalar meeting of -die Planning Commission was called
to order by Qaiom— Agan at 7:4S poo. on November 18,
1970 in the Plymouth ` Public I'Porks Build.irng r
JIM -SEW: Chairman i:gan, Planner Bergly, C;omDissi.oners
ilafhar, ,lune, rreki= er and Pollock and
Comri.ssioners Chapman and Roth arrived at
about. 8:00 p.m. and Comadssioner Neils
arrived at 9;00 p.m;
ABSENT: Commissicner Kroskin
The iirst item of business was a public hearing on petition i T Rezoning for
of B.A. Hickok of ' 6-ndota Inc. to change thee zoning from h.A. Hickok
R-0 to R-1, R-:, R 4 and E-2 for land generally located north of Mendota
of County Road #10 at Zachary Lane. Planner Bergly gave a Inc. from R-0
short presentation in this area and he stated that the to R-1, R-31
arca in question is *iorth of County Road #10 and that the R-4 E-2.
property lies almost d. dway between #194 and County Road #18.
The area contains about 125 acres and the developers plan
is to put about 20 acres inyto R-1, 55 acres into R-3, 18
acres into R-4, and about 4 acres into B-2., Apprc ximately
25 acres 1:1 be dedicated for park land purposes. A total
of about Bwd units will be proposed on the site. He said
that more detail plans would have to be shorn before this
could be acce=pted as a Planned Unit .Development_.
Mr. Hickok then presented his proposal before the Planning.
Corwai,ssi.on, fie stated that this particular piece of property
has been in the family for Litany years and he has lived on
the land mid he knows this area very well. tie said that the
reason the lake has no development on it is that the surround- urroundinginglandha<: been retained in large ownerships.. He said that
the heavy wooded area: would be uEed for the tmrwnhouse develop-
ment because this type of duelling could be put in without
disturbing the woods and also that the pond like area would
be dedicated for part, purposes. lie stated that the lake is a
lake, and not a swamp. The: area built for commercial use would
be used only as a convenience shopping center for the people
who live in this area. He also stated that they would like to
have a private water system, for this development. Mr. Hickok
stated; that thny would like to know as developers what the
Planning Co=r,;,sion thinks of this idea, and he would also
clarify any questions the Conmaission may have.
Chairman Egan asked if the area indicated as park dedication
Planning Comraisslon Minutes Page 2 November 18, 1970
area would support ;mg -le family development and this was
answered to be yes. Com issioner. June asked what are we
going to do with the sewer system until 'fey get sc ver upth0re- qtr. Hickok said that nothing; could be done without
the sewer, and he feels if they petition for sever that
they Malay got it and would like it within a year. Commissioner
Chapman asked if there was anything thought about a connecting
road to get to County (toad 018. Plarrner .Borgly said that
the topography looks like itwould be better to, put a road'
to the south possibly on the dividing line between single
family and townhouse areas. Convaissioner flafner asked what
the reason was for not developing the area which they were
going to dedicate for park purposes. Mr. Hickok said that
they are proposing,a public access to the lake on the west
side and that access would have to be through their property.
Commissioner Hafxer then .asked if this could be used by the
public, which, was answered to be yes. Cor issioner Chapman
asked fir. Hickok if he would be the developer as far as
developing the property, and. Tom Maple said that there would
probably be a ,point venture and there would not: be one builder x
but about throe qualified builders with Mr, Hickok as a
co -developer.
Charman Egan asked if there were any questions from the
audiance and Mr. Ronald Libby of 11540 County Road 010
said he was concerned as to what type of connercial area
would be placed here,, and Tom Maple answered that they
only wished to put in a convenience center which ixuld
meet what the people needed in this area,
Planner llergly stated that there may need, to be two seperate
accesses to the lake, one for the public and another for
the residents who live In the protect. fie Stated that the
marina is more or less a private access to the laked
Commlissxoner Hafner asked what type of bottom thG lake had
an"d if it could be used for swimming and MY. Ifickok said
that there was swid on the hottorn but the lake would have to
be cleaned out before swhrming could be done., Commissioner
Hafnear asked Mr. Hickok when lie 'could plan to start this
project and approxitrlately how long this would take to finish,
and Mr. Hickok, said that they would like to start: m a year
or so and that it would take about three years for com-
pletion, fie stated that they would probably start their
building in the townhouse area. Commissioner Hafner then
stafe4 that he l nowrs Mfr. Hickok was well, knoi n in the Win
Cities area,, for his study of ecology and that anyone with
the background and interest of this would develop this with
the best possible use of what the land has to offer.
O airman Egan said that we should look at several things such
as
p1. Ibe ncunber of units is about twice what it would be
in all single family development so we should take
a close look at the density of the area,
2 The ner t thing is look at like Lake, as Plymouth has
Plam Cor nissionF Mmiltes Page 3 November 18, 197+
only about 1/3' of the shore, lame, and consider
if this should somxhour be ccr ected with develop-
ment
evelop-
ment ill Maple Grvre.
Consider ikether the land to the west would have
access I this property if it will be single
family ,and whether or not any charges will be
recommended,
pally the B-2 use Jis oxily about four acresand
this is too .small for B-2.. Ife should consider
any commercial property in this area as it relates
to the B-4 to the west of axe property with two
convenience se,,vices of shopping and Liquor
stores,
Comsioner Chapman asked when we can get. an .answer as to
when sewer will be available an this area. W. Hickok said
that they will petition that they get sevmr and water in
this area, mrd Commissioner Chapman, stated that maybe when,
they eco this study that they will rind that sewer isn't
necessary here- now and you won't be able to get it,
Mr. Hickok said that if you, look at the plans for Maple
Grove it seems to be lake it would be needed hers. Mr.
Hickok said the sewer routes come through Naple Grove
to the north. Commissioner June asked if to use park
property on the east side if there is any other way to
put an access through there.. Mfr. Hickok said that they
would see that they have an easement to the lake across
Park property. -Commissioner .lune suggested that we have
the Bark Commission look at this and said it was about:
the ideal thing as to what they wanted.
Planner Ber,gly spoke in regard to the slzg e farml
continuing, to the east and northeast and he stated that
thore is single family adjacent 'to :-agle Sake and he
felt that they should talk with the planners for fir.
Hickok; and th;n% about connecting the two single family
areas to fog j small commtity.
CoRmissioner Doth asked if the proposed public access would
be .dor boats and fir. Hickok said that it would have to be
designatod as to whether boats would be allowed here or riot.
and what kinds of boats could be in .here.. Commissioner
Roth asked if the traffic would go through the single
family and Planner Bergly said that this would be a public
street. Chairman Egan felt that not Many motor roars should. be permitted in the lake. Coamdssioner Roth said his only
concern, is for the sheet which may develop into a main
access for 'both Dike and Eagle .bake.
Chairman Egan asked for .any more questions and he said he
might point out that this is not something to make a
decision on tonight as;d said a study must be clone, 'lhe
ubl is hearing was closed at 8 r 20 p.ru
Planning Commission Minutes Page 4 November 18, 1970
The next item of business was a public hearing on petition. RC. Rezoning for
of United Sand, Inc, to chango the zoning :From R-1. to R-4 Utited Land
for Land generally located in the vicinity of Highway 55 from R-1 to
d the Minneapolis &, Western Railroad Tracks. R-4.
The public hearing was opened at 8:25 p.m. Planner iergly
said that the proposed property for rezoning is just west
of the R-4 area and north of the Minneapolis & Western
Railroad Ti acksT "lbe access through the property is
through one: of the ownerships of the single family area.
Skip WCamrbs representing this proposal, stated th.'t at
the last meeting of the Planning Commission the bi*
discussion carne around the availability of an access, to
the site in this a:ea.. They were asked to work out some-
thing with the 11i,ghway Depart!,'<unt and had previously
submitted a: site plan, They showed a map of the new
road layout and said the present-entrance would be
closed and moved 1.501 to the west. It was also suggested
that we should take into account the ICighways plans for
a future interchange, but at the time they have no plans
for an interchange, The have not considered any aspects
of an interchange.
Mr. McCombs said the Highway Department said they would
be agreeable to all construction of the proposed frontage
road and morning the crossover approximately 125 feet to
the west, there would be no cost to the Mate and based
on the following requi.sities.
1. The frontage road and cross-over will, be
desigmed and constructed at no cost to
the State of Minnesota.
2. Final plans showing all details including
drainage, geometries and sections must
be submitted: for final approval.
3. The present cross-over, Qakview Lane entrance,
and entrance permit. SAD-69-64 must be
obliterated and removed.
4 Implace drainage :must be maintained in its
present mariner.
S. Agreements for maintenance of frontage road
must be secured with the Village of Plymouth.
6. A bond will be required in the amount to be
determined. by the Roadway Regulation
Supervisor.
7. Forward all,copies of the attached permit to
Mr, Jack Reichel, Roadway Regulation. Supervisor,
Minnesota Highway Department, 2055 North ,Lilac
Drive, l n eapolis, Minnesota 55422, The
application will be processed as soon as possible.
Mr. McCombs felt that this is the proper intersecion that
can be provided and it over cones the items of concern
and should actually improve the access. Ile. said the re-
zoning they are asking for now is simply a continuation
Planning Coma f, ssion Minutes. Page 5 November 19, 1970
of the R-4 that they have already rezoned and that this is
accordance with the Guide plan.
Chairman Bon said he didn't know the problems the Village
would have in changing Oakview Lana access. lie felt the
plans were improving as far as the site is concerned, lie
stated that the petits oner has not yet d' cussed the other
problems whish were denied and it was answered that they
Wore not asking for s;.te plan approval but only rev, ning
of the property. lie also stated that for a Communa,ty
Unit Projtct, that they vust see the site plans when re - e-
W. .4cCombsW..4cCombs asked: if they could. get agreement on this if
they work out the other problems to be acceptable. Com-
missionor June said that what they are looking for is
if we will approve the road plan and approve the R-4
district, lie faint that the planning Cmmission should
gave them an answer as to how they feel about this.
Chairman Egan stated that he was in favor of the rezoning. W. Jones- said that one of the p'.rQblerns is that they
array spend a great deal 'of money on plans which the.
CoTmaission may never approve. Commissioner Chapman asked
if they have met with the people in the neighborhood
and if the people had been notified and he felt that
a public hearing may have, to be held over again, W.
DeZei3 said that this wouldn't have to have a public
hearing because this is all State Highway Property
and the reason they don't have a site plan is because the
Conmd.ssion wants the buildings relocated and they don't
know where to put them.
Next, members of the audience were asked if they had
any questions and the next person to speak was pee
Swenson•, who laves on the Circle. She ,said he con-
cern would be of the ingress and egressand she felt
that this wasn It a good place to put all this traffic
because of the bridge and because of Beacon Ilelg}its
School.,
The next person to speak was a mai who lived at 1220
Eves Lane who questioned whether they sometimes approve
pieces of rezoning ComAss. ones Chapitan said that
originally there was just the one-piece tdhich they- heyrezonedrezonedbutnowtheyhaveacquiredthe 'piece which
extends to the lake.
Mother man from 1453 Larch Lane felt that ghat has
been clone with. the Highway plain has not solved anything,
that they only pat the traffic in a different place.
Chairman ligan felt that they have ,a safer intersection,
Jim Brown of 1414 barch Lane said that everyone. is satinsaying
that t xis is a better intersection, but he s not
sure of that.
Planning Commission Minutes page 6 November 185 1970
MMMR
Mr. WCombs told t,t.Ae P.7 morin C{imm,irJ+r`x on at the highway.. .
department had no plans at this time. commi
Planning Cco. dssign Minutes Page 7 November 18, 1970
1. Widened the right-of-way of Xonium and have
increased the right-of-way of the circular
road
2. Site grade has been revised and will lower
the southwest corner of the plat so that it
will be within 1/2 foot of the MJ .P. plat
3. ale presented the drainage and said that it
would be carried to the ponding area in the
south
lle stated that they ;have came to the conclusion that they
should petition the grillage for a study of the drainage,
11e explained that what they are asking fon is approval of
the industrial area and the access to the meditm density
area.
Mx, gale Kennedy stated that when this was proposed two
years ago that it was requested that the people around
this area, should be notified. A man from 13th Avenue
North said he was concerned with the height of the
buildings and it 'vas answered that most of the buildings
would; be only one star•, lie also asked: if the peaple
would be notified of this hearing and It way m sivered
that only, the people would be notified within 400' of
the property,
Commissioner Pollock made a motion that the request be MNION
approved subject to the following:
1. Subject to approval of the drainage and, utility
plan by the Villago Engineer,
21 Subject to the site plan being amended to
eliminate trackage any further south than
halfway beyond Lot 5.
11iis was seconded by C onum ssi.oner Prekker for discussion.
Coamissi.oaer Prekker asked why they sh,oul.d, put a spur
in at all. He said even if the spur doesn't go in
that they should still add the berm to the site. Ile
felt it would be .a very goad. addition. The motion was
carried by a 6 in favor vote while Commissioner June
opposed..
11he net item of business was the discussion of the RC Kenneth
Kenneth. Schi.ebe Rezoning to change the zoning .from fix' h ebe
R-0 Open Residential District to h-4 General Business Rezoning
Dzstrsc, , RW4 VUltiple Family Residence District and
R-3 Multiple Family Residence District (townhouse) for
property generally located at the Southeast corner
of State Hhway 101 and County Road #6.
At the October 21 1970 meeting of the Planning CormAissiozi
the request for the reigning was denied, The Council felt
that a compri,i e could be made between the parties and also
that the party should ]feet with Adie neighborhood. W.
Stenquist presented the now plan Which they felt would be
acceptable ,% al.,o explained that the triangle piece of
planing coonission, Minuses Page ;R November 18, 1970`
i
land was a problem, because the owner did not want to sell
this land and holdingwas, out: oxo they, which wa. their
problem: the ch -tinges , in the new plan included those of.
the road and al$0 reducing the density. The townhouse
units would be eliminated and apartment units would t, e
their place, which would leave more green open spacer
Tae area between the apartments and the single family area
would be heavily planted and you would not be able to
be seen by the single fwrdly area. the business area
could include an area of about 7 acres, Chairman Egan
slso .seated that. they prefer this aresa to be a h-2 use
instead, of a 13-4 use area, The men said that the only
reason they asked for B-4 was because it has a limit
on the number of stories of the building. Corrtmi,ssioner
ekker felt that the traffic problem would be a bigfactorhere. -
r..Stmquist felt that Booth pro osalrs should be taken
and presented to the public.
The next itu, of business was, to discuss with the PX- Discussion
developer a plan for developing slingle family bones with
at the R-2 density generalSy located west 'of i xnkirk developer Of
and south of County Road M Ilan: for
Mie developer, Charles: Nolan, said that the intention
area generall
west of
is that they should propose this project on a Dunkirk and
basis of density. Ibe units will be pre -built units south of
that will be mach like any other home except that they Co, lid. #6
wll sell for less
Ile distributed a book to the t,,u, .bers of the Planning
Commission ,which explained different plans which
can bo used in developing the area. The members
of the Caunission felt that this type of housing
could be used in certain areas of Plymouth but that
tzis type of housing did not fit in the area proposed.
Me Carvai.ssion had do0ts as to hota the houses would
sell, aha. Nolan said that a -built house withpre:
three bedrooms would sell for about $20,000 while
a conventional house the sapie size would sell for about
thrice as much, Mr. Nolan. said that since people do
not have this kind of money any more, that he felt that
these pre built houses would sell very well.
The Commissioners expressed their idea: towards this type
Of housing. Chairman bgan felt that about as far as
the cost of the houses went, that Plymouth does not
have to hava any certain prices. Corrunissioner rune
felt that something of this order is going to come
out of th.'i housing market very scon,. Commissioner
Neils felt that there are some very high valued homes
in the area, and that these ltaies should not be placed
here.
The Commission feat that this may be possile to do in
Planning Comiss on, Wzuteq Page Noveaer 5.8, 1070
the area yet it should he .done on a mallet basis.
Co 'rs'.oner Pollock stated that our ordinance does not
de for this and if wo wish for this that we should
request an amendment to, the ordinance,
Tho .minutes of -the, ;November 4, 10'0 meeting were approved RE Minutes of
With the followin age: That the hearing on petition November
of Programmed hand, Inc, was never closed, The moti 4, 1970
was made by Commissioner June and seconded by Commissioner approved
Volloc%. Commissioner RreRker abstained -wyhile the rest
were in favor of the matron. The motionwas carried.
The meeting was adjourned at 1:00 A.M.. J'pU`'tP.i''