HomeMy WebLinkAboutPark and Recreation Advisory Commission Minutes 10-08-1998Minutes of the Park and Recreation Advisory Commission Meeting
October 8, 1998
Page 32
Present: Chair Anderson, Commissioners Fiemann, Musliner, Thompson, Wahl, Willegalle,
staff Bisek, Blank, Buck, Pederson
Absent: Commissioner Priebe
CALL TO ORDER
Chair Anderson called the October meeting to order at 7 p.m. in the Council Chambers.
2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
A motion was made by Commissioner Willegalle and seconded by Commissioner Musliner
to approve the minutes of the September meeting as presented. The motion carried with all
ayes.
3. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS
a. Athletic Associations.
b. Staff Fall programs are winding down. Soccer pictures are being distributed now.
We're going to be working with another experimental software program on a method of
putting the brochure on the Internet, Mary explained. At some point in the fiiture it may
become interactive and we would probably ask PRAC to be testers again. There was a
large ad in the Lakeshore Weekly News today about the parade and also an article in the
Sailor. Mary distributed flyers on the schedule of events. Mary invited commissioners to
be present for the dedication of the art piece donated by the Radisson Hotel to be installed
in the lobby of the ice center at 4 p.m. on Saturday. Over 100 units are lined up to be in
the parade. We are looking for someone to be Santa Claus for Old Fashioned Christmas.
The November brochure is on its way to the printer.
c. Others.
4. PAST COUNCIL ACTION
Council held a special meeting to discuss the activity center/fieldhouse. They voted to leave
the facility where it's proposed. Last night they authorized the architects to go to the next
level of design, putting the bidding on schedule for March 1999.
5. UNFINISHED BUSINESS
a. Open space — review recommendations. Paul Buck, the city forester, was present to
represent the open space committee. Other members of the committee were unable to
attend the meeting. Paul briefly reviewed the management practices that are being
recommended by the committee for three of the open space sites.
Ann Ebbers, 17925 12th Avenue, said that her property adjoins the Hardenburg property.
She is very happy about this site. One thing that is making her nervous is the parking in
front of her house. She wondered if the City is going to widen her street, in order to
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accommodate visitors coming to this park. Director Blank said no and thinks there will
be very little traffic here but the City will monitor it. She was also concerned about the
spread of purple loosestrife and wants it stopped if possible. Paul Buck said loosestrife is
treated site specifically.
Bill Williams, 1325 Peony Lane, owns property on the north and east side of the
Hardenburg property. He is concerned about traffic on the street and about the type of
controls placed on the property as far as access at night. He doesn't want it to turn into a
party place after dark. He is also concerned about the pond on Co. Rd. 6. He cleans up
the pond in the spring of pop and beer bottles, styrofoam containers, etc. Another
concern is about building areas for picnics and how this would be monitored. He
advocates placing of trails throughout the area. Director Blank said these issues are the
same ones we deal with daily at all of our parks. Park properties close at 10 p.m.
throughout the city. Director Blank stated that the City has a bike patrol which monitors
park areas in the summer. He also said we rely on the eyes and ears of the neighbors to
report anything suspicious. He indicated that litter will be collected on a regular basis.
Linda Wilson lives adjacent to the property at 18305 11th Avenue where it T's into
Urbandale Lane. She is also concerned about issues of loitering and trash and doesn't
want a picnic site on the property. She feels this is not consistent with leaving it natural.
She wanted to know if any type of trail system would be installed and if the boundaries of
the property would be designated with fences or posts. She also had questions about
limited access and what that means. There is also an accumulation of brush piles in the
area and she asked if those will be cleaned up? Director Blank said there are no
immediate plans to put in a picnic site. Where the house sat there may be picnicking in
the fi ture. 6 x 6 posts would be put up in the corners of the property and perhaps every
300 feet or so. The City will not advertise it as open space, but it will be identified as
such on city maps. Paul Buck said the brush piles will be collected after property
boundaries are established. Nothing has been determined on the type of trails to be
installed. Limited access means informing the public that the site exists, but not
encouraging widespread use. Staff is currently anticipating that only immediate
neighbors will be the ones to use it the most. Trails would be internal within the site and
not connected to the city's main trail system.
Brice Hesse, 1105 Peony Lane, lives east of the property. He is concerned about the
parking. He has talked to six of his neighbors who all have said they do not want any
parking in front of their homes. He thinks the isolation of the site invites teen drinking
parties. This is an ideal site in the southwest area of Plymouth for trails. He feels the
ones that are there now are too narrow and wants them widened with a gravel base added.
He doesn't want the picnic shelter. He had a concern about the statement in the letter that
discusses educating the neighborhood on environmentally friendly management of the
shoreline. Paul Buck explained that was meant as a way to inform neighbors what the
city intends to do in the way of lakeshore management. It was not intended to imply that
neighbors are doing anything wrong. Commissioner Willegalle said that he has spent
many years working with the City regarding these kinds of issues. He agrees that more
education is needed, so residents know what is going on.
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Charlie McCarty, 17830 8th Avenue, lives south of the property. He walks it two or
three times a week. He wonders what to do as a homeowner to buffer his property from
the pond. He likes the trails being improved somewhat; widened, but not paved or
anything like that.
Sigrid Hommeyer, 18215 13th Avenue, lives on the north side of the property. Every
year they go in and pick up trash. They have sent letters to neighbors asking them not to
dump leaves, etc. She wants to keep the trails as natural as possible. They've tried to
clear dead brush and are wondering if some of the dead trees will be removed. Some of
them have fallen onto the trails. Paul Buck said they will clean up around the edges and
if any trails are established by the City, they will clear those. They may not necessarily
clear away the trees that have fallen on the natural trails. Director Blank said managing
open space is a new area for the city and will be a learning process. The city owns 60
park sites offering varying opportunities. Not all riles will be established tonight. The
overall principal is protecting property in its present state. Staff will look at existing
trails and make sure that they are passable and will look at erosion issues. We will study
whether or not additional trails need to be installed. The City is always open to
suggestions. The key is to have good communication between the park users and the
City.
Marlin Sjaarda, 11720 38th Avenue, is on the open space subcommittee and has been
since its inception in 1994. He stated committee did not support developed trails, but
they did support a wood chip trail around the high school open space property. There
was no strong support for a picnic shelter on the Hardenburg site. He supports the
Minnesota Land Trust and the conservation easement idea and believes that the property
should be protected into perpetuity. Commissioner Fiemann asked what size the picnic
shelter would be. Mr. Sjaarda said if one is built it would be the same size as the house
that sat on the property. Commissioner Musliner asked if Mr. Sjaarda had alternatives to
the easement issue. He responded that beyond the 15 year guarantee, the only thing that
ensures it remains as open space is a conservation easement, but it would not necessarily
have to be controlled by the Minnesota Land Trust. It could be a group of citizens
appointed by the City or the City itself.
Chair Anderson said the Commission has several options at this point. They can continue
to study the issue; can make a recommendation to the Council with the information they
have now; or they can ask staff to study it fi rther. Commissioner Wahl agrees with the
suggestions made by the city attorney. In a letter sent to Director Blank, the city attorney
advises that the best way to preserve our current open space is to have the City pass a
charter amendment which would require voter approval to sell open space that's been
acquired via a bond referendum. The City Attorney commented in his letter that tying
land up in perpetuity makes the assumption that we are wiser than fi ture generations.
Commissioner Musliner has concerns about the perpetuity issue and with turning the
open space over to the Land Trust. She recommended to have the Council address the
issue of how long the land should be protected. Commissioner Thompson was also
concerned about tying up the land into perpetuity. Commissioner Fiemann would like to
have a better understanding of what a charter amendment is. Chair Anderson said he
doesn't feel comfortable making any recommendation right now. He also wants a better
understanding of what the city attorney is recommending. Commissioner Wahl stated
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that the ultimate goal of the open space committee is for the sites to remain as natural as
possible. He reiterated that there would never be a paved trail on the Hardenburg site.
Paul Buck said it is also the goal of the City to keep these sites as natural as possible.
Director Blank will ask the city attorney to further explain the conservation easement and
the charter amendment idea for next month's meeting and the pro's and con's of each.
Once the Commission has made their recommendation, it will go forward to the City
Council, and it will ultimately be up to them to make a final recommendation. Director
Blank and Chair Anderson informed the audience that the open space issue would remain
on the Commission's monthly agenda until a decision is made, and they were encouraged
to continue to attend the meetings.
b. Activity center/fieldhouse update. Subcommittee reviewed the latest plans and
authorized the architect to proceed to the next phase. He will attend the next PRAC
meeting with the plans. Commissioner Thompson said to add to the minutes that her
hat's off to Director Blank and other City staff for their presentation to the Council at the
Sept. 28 meeting . She said it was very impressive.
c. 1999-2003 CIP. Director Blank discussed the estimated costs for projects planned in
1999 and 2000. He said that Elm Creek Playfield needs more signage. The three
playground replacements include Green Oaks, LaCompte, and Turtle Lake parks. Youth
Sports Fields Upgrade - Director Blank will be getting some quotes from architects for
upgrading those facilities based on how the district referendum comes out. Director
Blank may recommend dropping the lighting at Zachary for 1999, but will replace
benches, etc. The mini -park at Vicksburg and 22nd includes grading, trails, seeding, and
park benches. Staff is working with the city manager and finance director on a financial
package for acquisition of the 10th playfield site in 2000. The CIP will continue to be
refined and will be carried over to the November meeting for action at that time.
Commissioner Thompson asked for clarification on the location of Mud Lake
neighborhood park. Director Blank explained that it's near Camelot Estates. Less than
half of the walking neighborhood is developed at this time. This is the last neighborhood
park to be developed in the system. Commissioner Musliner asked about the resident
letter in her packet requesting that the city buy some land in northeast Plymouth.
Director Blank said this site was proposed by a developer for a movie theater complex,
but the request was denied. Commissioner Wahl said this site is very small and next to
the freeway. It ranked low on the list of possible open space sites when sites were first
being evaluated.
6. NEW BUSINESS
There was no new business to discuss.
7. COMMISSION PRESENTATION
Commissioner Musliner asked Mary about the Autumn Arts Fair. Mary said it was well
attended, but that the site needs to be evaluated. There was more room for people to set up
their displays, but no building for the seniors. It's not as widely known as Parkers Lake. It
was very windy that day, and the rain held off until the very end of the event. Commissioner
Musliner thought the site was difficult to maneuver with strollers because of the grassy area.
It was also tough for wheelchairs.
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8. STAFF COMMUNICATION
Director Blank congratulated Commissioner Wahl on his photo of a train in a snowstorm,
which was the grand prize winner in the city's photo contest.
9. ADJOURNMENT
The meeting adjourned at 8:45 p.m.