HomeMy WebLinkAboutCity Council Minutes 05-21-2002 SpecialAdopted Minutes
Special Council Meeting
May 21, 2002
A Special Meeting of the Plymouth City Council was called to order by Mayor Tierney at 7:05
p.m. on May 21, 2002 in the Council Chambers, 3400 Plymouth Boulevard.
COUNCIL PRESENT: Mayor Tierney, Councilmembers Harstad, Hewitt, Slavik, Johnson,
Stein and Black.
ABSENT: None.
STAFF PRESENT: City Manager Johnson, Public Works Director Faulkner, Community
Development Director Hurlburt, Park Director Blank, Finance Director Hahn, Fire Chief Kline,
Police Chief Gerdes, Attorney Knutson, and Deputy City Clerk Hoffman.
Discussion of Issues with Residents of Northwest Plymouth
Mayor Tierney announced that one hour of the meeting will be dedicated to a discussion with
Northwest Plymouth residents. She stated some residents are interested in speaking to the
Council about parcels of land designated in the Comprehensive Plan to retain rural zoning
classifications.
Community Development Director Hurlburt illustrated the areas in Northwest Plymouth that are
designated as non—urban in the City's Comprehensive Plan. She stated residents are concerned
about the amount of land outside the urban service area that couldn't be developed. She stated
the city anticipates urbanization to occur by 2020 when sewer and water would be extended in
Northwest Plymouth. She noted that there would be a 2008 update of the Comprehensive Plan,
and there could be different options as some of the utilities could be available.
Councilmember Harstad asked about the length of time required to revise the Comprehensive
Plan. Community Development Director Hurlburt responded that it could take up to three years.
Len Luedke, 17910 County Road 47, expressed his concerns about development of land in
Northwest Plymouth. He referred to the Metropolitan Council guidelines for improvements to
County Roads 101, 47, and 10. He noted that Vicksburg Lane, Schmidt Lake Road, Lawndale
Lane, and Peony Lane are all scheduled for upgrades as well in the near future. He noted that
land owned by the Wayzata School District and by the City is designated for development within
five years. He stated the Elm Creek Interceptor should be started next year. He stated he is not
asking for property owners with abutting wetlands to allow their land to become urbanized. He
pointed to five parcels designated to remain undeveloped and stated they all adjoin land that is in
some stage of development. He stated the sewer trunk line is scheduled to go through two of
those parcels this summer. He stated when water service is provided to the proposed elementary
l
school, extension of the service would be possible within one quarter of mile to the school. He
J noted that the City purchased water from Maple Grove last summer, and suggested future water
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Special Council Meeting
May 21, 2002
Page 2 of 6
needs also be considered. He added that Maple Grove officials have already discussed traffic
issues adjacent to Northwest Plymouth and have cited rural roads with inadequate signal lights
and signs as issues that need to be addressed sooner rather than later. He referred to a Star
Tribune news article forecasting urban population levels in the area by 2020. He suggested the
Metropolitan Council might be more inclined to pay for sewer hookups if more homes were
interested in receiving urban services. He believes a majority of Northwest Plymouth landowners
who have land to develop want to develop it. He stated changes in how the tax base is set mean
increases in market value for land and homes increases in taxes will be driven by the value of
developable land. He requested the Council allow development of Northwest Plymouth.
Jerry Cornish, 15920 County Road 47, stated he supports development, as he is concerned about
future tax changes.
Vernon Peterson, 17425 County Road 47, stated he supports allowing the parcels to be
developed. He sees no reason to keep an area designated as rural when those neighboring the
parcels can develop their land. He noted that improvements on Lawndale Lane have meant
higher traffic, speeds, and this would probably occur when improvements are made to Peony and
Troy Lanes. He added that not being able to develop land limits their enjoyment of urban
services and access to utilities.
Peter Coyle, an attorney from Larkin Hoffman, 7900 Xerxes Avenue South, stated he is
representing a group of Northwest Plymouth property owners. He praised Mr. Luedke's
comments. He stated the Comprehensive Plan is a City policy document that needs to be
approved, reviewed, and amended when needed. He stated the inherent conflict reflected in
Northwest Plymouth calls for no growth when there is a presumption that urban style
development is anticipated. He asked the Council to set the review and amendment process in
place sooner rather than later and to allow orderly development.
Anne Marie Solberg, an attorney representing the William Baer family of 5540 Ranier Lane,
stated that the Baers farm their land. However, the future urban service line would zigzag
through their property and make it impossible for them to farm the land. She asked about the
restrictions on development and whether undeveloped areas would be assessed for the utility
service. Community Development Director Hurlburt responded that when development is
permitted, the area would be assessed when the hook—up is made. She stated that Medina
currently utilizes Plymouth's local sewer lines, but in the future they would utilize the Elm Creek
Interceptor, which would improve Plymouth's capacity to more adequately serve Plymouth
residents.
Al Goblirsch, 5505 Vicksburg Lane, stated residents who live along his street paid for the
improvements on Vicksburg Lane. He stated it is difficult to continue to pay taxes on the
increased market levels with a $30,000 per year income. He suggested people who want a rural
country setting should pay to enjoy that.
Judy Luedke, 17910 County Road 47, stated she believes people will have to pay assessments for
the sewer and water services whether they hook up or not through their property taxes.
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Special Council Meeting
May 21, 2002
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Mayor Tierney thanked the residents who attended the meeting. She stated the Council
understands the pressure for residents to develop their property. She stated the City would not
restrict the sale of the land. Community Development Director Hurlburt explained there is a
zoning requirement of a minimum of 20 acres for residential development in this area.
Councilmember Harstad stated the limited market value and increases assume that the tax rate
will stay the same, but the rates usually decrease. He stated he doesn't want to see people forced
off their land because they can't pay property taxes. He added that growth could decrease as land
values appreciate.
Mr. Goblirsch responded that the City may not forbid the sale of their land, but the value of the
property would not be realized in a sale. He stated residents are paying taxes on their land as if it
has greater worth, but there is an affordability issue.
Mayor Tierney stated these issues would be reviewed. She stated not this year but sometime in
the future land configurations and topography would be reviewed.
Councilmember Johnson stated the no -growth option was unrealistic. However, the
Comprehensive Plan for the area was well—planned by staff to manage growth in anticipation of
the infrastructure. She stated the development of bridges and streets is meant to benefit the
residents, and the City needs to review how to balance development with the interests of
residents.
Councilmember Hewitt thanked residents for attending the meeting. She understands market
value concerns and believes development issues need to be reviewed before 2008.
Mayor Tierney agreed that there is pressure to develop the land. She reminded residents of the
lengthy process to re -study the guide plan.
Lawful Gambline Ordinance
Police Chief Gerdes discussed requests by the Plymouth Lions Club and the Plymouth Crime and
Fire Prevention Fund to permit charitable gambling in the City. He stated the Council could
either direct staff to prepare an ordinance permitting charitable gambling or discontinue the
discussion. He reviewed State statutes and guidelines permitting cities to regulate charitable
gambling. He stated questions to be discussed include whether gambling is appropriate, how it
could be restricted, and whether there would be a conflict of interest for the Crime and Fire
Prevention Fund to participate as a licensee, when they would be also be recipient of some of the
proceeds.
Mayor Tierney asked what types of gambling would an ordinance cover. Police Chief Gerdes
replied that it is very unusual to see anything other than pull tabs and bingo. He stated pull tabs
are the most profitable form of gambling.
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Special Council Meeting
May 21, 2002
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Councilmember Stein asked if the City could limit the number of licenses. Police Chief Gerdes
responded that a limit would not be an equal application of law if the number issued is only one,
but that application to other sites would remove any conflict of interest for the City. Attorney
Knutson stated the City could impose a limit in theory but the application of that could be a
challenge. He suggested the possibility of a drawing to grant applicants a license.
In response to questions about limiting locations, Police Chief Gerdes stated the typical
restaurant chains would not allow gambling on their premises. He stated the majority of the
licensees would be from charitable groups, athletic, or sportsmen's organizations.
Councilmember Johnson supports proceeding with developing an ordinance and referring any
proposals to the Public Safety Advisory Board for review.
Councilmember Black stated this is a philosophical issue and thinks the City shouldn't proceed
with an ordinance allowing gambling.
Councilmember Harstad agreed with Councilmember Black. He believes there is too much
proliferation of gambling, and that it is not merely an entertainment. He stated it creates societal
costs beyond its merit.
Councilmember Harstad made a motion, seconded by Councilmember Black, not to take any
action on this request.
Councilmember Hewitt agreed with Councilmembers Harstad and Black. She believes there is a
conflict of interest with the Crime and Fire Prevention Fund organization. She noted the negative
impact of money spent on gambling. She does not agree that because other cities have it
Plymouth needs it. She agreed that fundraising is getting harder to do, but that it doesn't justify
the City's permitting of gambling.
Councilmember Stein stated people who have a gambling problem would gamble regardless of
where it is available.
Councilmember Slavik stated she is undecided with this issue.
Mayor Tierney stated there could be problems associated with gambling. She stated many issues
need to be studied, but she views gambling as entertainment. She would support receiving further
comments and pursuing further study.
Lions Club representative Ed Steinke stated he has worked with gambling in Wayzata and
suggested Plymouth prepare an ordinance. He stated pull tab games offer the largest paybacks to
players. He stated the Plymouth Lions Club only has a limited chance to sell fundraising tickets,
and this would allow another venue for that activity.
Dave Hogshire, 525 Brockton Lane, stated he and his wife have been involved with the
Plymouth Fire and Crime Prevention Fund, which gave $9,000 to the City for laser imaging
equipment. He stated the Council should weigh what the proceeds could purchase versus any
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Special Council Meeting
May 21, 2002
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social problems created by gambling. He stated he is glad the Council is asking constituents for
advice on the issue.
Councilmembers Harstad and Stein agreed that proper controls (oversight, audit, etc.) would be
required of any stated his family had cash businesses through his life, and he agrees that proper
controls are needed, but this is not a reason to deny an opportunity for the organizations.
Police Chief Gerdes stated that donations from the Crime and Fire Prevention Fund were
dedicated for unique purchases, such as the original K-9 purchases, and are now part of the City
budget.
Fire Chief Kline stated that all firefighting and fire prevention purchases are prioritized with
other City departments.
Councilmember Johnson stated the two different questions in philosophical and money areas
merit discussion and review. She supports public debate and education on the issues.
Councilmember Harstad stated that alcohol has effect of reducing inhibitions, and can't support
pull tab sales. He noted that lottery and scratch—off games are not being sold in the places where
alcohol is consumed.
1 Councilmember Johnson believes the government can't legislate all.
Councilmember Stein made a motion, seconded by Myor Tierney to call the question. With all
members voting in favor but Johnson, the motion carried.
The Council voted on the main motion and with all members voting against but Harstad, Hewitt,
and Black, the motion failed.
Councilmember Stein made a motion, seconded by Councilmember Johnson, to direct staff to
draft ordinance language permitting charitable Wig, which would be reviewed by the Public
Safety Advisory Board for review and comment.
Councilmember Slavik stated more public comment is needed on this request.
Mayor Tierney asked whether the City might narrow the scope of the ordinance and the
recipients of any proceeds. Police Chief Gerdes responded that there would be opportunities to
address those issues during the development of the ordinance language. He stated other
considerations include how to guide an application, and what fees could be charged for
administration and investigation costs.
Gordon Rabens, 1194 Xene Lane, suggested that if lawful gambling would be permitted, the City
require that a portion of the proceeds be allocated for college scholarships.
There being no further discussion, with Slavik, Johnson, Stein, and Tierney voting yes and with
Harstad, Hewitt, and Black voting no, the motion carried.
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Special Council Meeting
May 21, 2002
Page 6 of 6
Future Study Session Topics
Mayor Tierney suggested conducting a Study Session on June 4 at 6:30 p.m. to discuss the
findings of the Housing Forum. The Council unanimously agreed to schedule this meeting.
Mayor Tierney adjourned the meeting at 9:15 p.m. to the Medicine Lake Room for a quarterly
update from City Manager Johnson.
Deputy City Clerk