HomeMy WebLinkAboutCity Council Minutes 11-30-19700 0
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JOVU METING OF THE, COUNCIL 6 PLANNING CMKISSION
PLYMOUTH, MINNESOTA
I NDVEMIR 309 1970 '
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A joint rating of the Plymouth Village Council and Planning Commission was
called to order at 7:40 P.M, by Mayor Hilde Xon No%vuber 30, 1970.
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PRESENT: Mayor Hilda, CouncIlion Johnson, Kieoseth and Spaeth, Finance Director
Barnes, Consulting Engineers Bonsstroa and Olson, Planner Barglyi,
Planning Comptseloners Pollock, Prekki r, Nelle, Chepmso, Juni! and
Kroskin. Councilman Rant: arrived at 8900 Pa.
ABSENT: Planning Commission Chairman Egan a -Ad Coftlealoners Rafner and Roth.
DISBURSEMENTS
NOTION was made by Councilman Johnson, secpnd by Councilman Spaeth to adopt
RESOLUTION, NO. 70-494, A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE GBNtM FUND DISBURSElIW
IN THE AMOUNT OF $191,029.26 FOR THE PERIOD ENDING NOVl41,BER 236 1970.
Notion carried 4 aye roll call votes,
NOTION was made by Councilman Spaeth, second by Councilman Johnson to adopt
RESOLUTION NO. 70-495, A RESOLUTION APPROVING, THE CONSTRUCTION AND SINKING
FUND DISBURSBMNT IN THE AMOUNT OF $2,4409173.61 FOR TRE PUIOD ENDING
NOVEMBER 230 1970a lotion carried 4 aye roll call vote.
PROJECT LIST FOR.1971
R ZS. NO. 70-494
EHERAL FUO
DISBURSEMENT
Ras. NO. 70=495
OONSTRUCTION i
INKING FUND
DISBURSEMENT
The meeting :® discuss the 1971 Project List bcheduled for December 3, 1970 RE: PROJECT
was postponed to December 15, 1970 at 6:00 P.M. Mayor Hilda distributed LIST
his Project List to the Council and explained its' format.
THOROUGHFARE GUIDE PLAN RE: THOROUGH
FARY GUIDE PLAN
The following man who were invited to attend the meeting tonight intro -i
duced themselves: Messrs. J. L. Klemenhagen and Co D. Spencer of the county
Highway Engineering Departlrnt, Don Steelman and Don Galloway of the County
Highway Design Section, N. 0. Klossner, County Highway Engineer, Minnetonka
Village,Planner, Ray Maculans, Ted Pampernin of 515 N. Wedgewood Lane and
Richard Cox of NIP.
Mayor Wlde said the probAems and other items concerning Area 01 of the
Thoroughfare Guide Plan will be discussed tonight whtch are: (1) The lower
area bounded by Minnetonk4 Village concerning the alignment of County Road
015, (2) The diamond intetchange of County Road 061 which MIP dmolves,
3) The area along West Medicine Lake Drive involving village peck land,
4) The intersection of County I. -Id 024 and Highway OSS, (5) Resolution covering
the alignment and overpass at Highway 0101 and the Soo Line Railriad, (6) Set
public hearing dates.
Planner John Betgly pointed out on a wall map County Road 061 east of I.S. 0494
aligamnt and the Highwey 012 intersection. Also, the proposed realignment of
County Road 015. He stated that after a thorough study by the coriitue it was
decided not to have Country Road 061 go straight south and gave the reasons whyb
This was outlined in brown on the map. He also pointed out the broken blue
line which represented the alternate alignment recommended by the County.
which was to the east.
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Page 29 Joint feting, kov. 30, 1970 =`
Nfnnstouka Village Planner Maeulans said they have plans and proposed that i
County Road-061 be lo,6tad vest of the blue line and slated their reasons
for same., r
Planner Bergly said"It is felt that the aligeusnt of County Road 015 will
ret the present concept needs.
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Engineer Bonestroorasked if the present bridge on I.S. 0404 is adequate for
the anticipated ts affic. Mr. Klossner said it will br inadequate due to its'
width. Enginser T4nestroo asked what would be done in the future in this
regard and if enmothing is done her such will it cost to widen it versus
construction of a new bridge. Mr. Klossner said it would have to be widened
and five their 1:sndpoint there is nothing sacrad about the bridge or that
particular intetchange. The interchange could,be changed one way or,another,
possibly to the north which would require a new bridge. Hngins Bonestroo
said bridges that get widened present a financing problem. An alternate
would be to sore the bridge north and he pointed out the location which would
then affect th'Q proposed align ents.-Rature building expected and resulting
north bound traffic. Mr. Klemenhagen said the County will not finance the
Interchange at County Roads 016 and 061. The financing would have to be
worked out with the State. Mr. Cox said the purpose of this interchanC-a is
to serve the area to the south and vest of Section 3 ik Minnetonka.
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Mayor Hilde said County Road 015, vest of I.S. 0494, should be prevented from
becoming a thoroughfare because of the neighborhood and wry narrow road. It
doss not have eno-4h rightw-of-way for widening without taking uut a row of
houses. Councilman 81nts said he liked Engineer Bonestroo's suggestion to
move the intersection north. County Road 015 vast of I.S. 1494 would never
become a major thoroughfare. Traffic would wove south off of Fernbrook Lane
to Harbor Lane and go into the interchange on Highway 112.
Engineer Bonestroo pointed out an alternate alignment to purl Folubrook Lane
more westerly giving 1.000 ft. width at the diamond and stated his reasons for
this. Engineer Olson substantiated the proposal. Kr. Maculans evleined
Minnetonka Village's position on this and he displayed their.)Conceptual
Development Plan for Sections 2, 3 and 4. they want to go on record and state
that bey prefer the brown alignment of County Road 061 rather than the blue
easterly line because the R4 neighborhood would L)p preserved and the two
large planned commercial developments proposed on Highway 012 and the HIP
proptrty to the northwest, which will create additional traffic. This shows
that% is a need to strengthen the interchange. He pointed out which area
they would Gather concede than distrub the resideatial area and mentioned
the engineeping problems that would be ercounterad. Mayor Hilde asked his
If they go along then with our brown line and he replle4 yes, and we iish to
go on record making this statement. We would like to see some buffers for
tba nice hoaxes along the east side of it.
Mr. Klemenhagen said the County preferred the blue alignment because of the
engineering problems that musk be considered, which he explatne4 In detail
and asked Mr. MacUans if their council hes ta:_en a definite sthnd one the
beown alignment. Mr. Maeulans said it has been adopted by the Planning
Commission but not tho council% We do not like the County plan becauoo it
will take away the R-1 segment and the added traffic will damage the neigh-
borhood. Mr. Klemenhtgen said, am I to take it for granted then, that these
people are kngwledgeable about the ai:%ration? Mr. Maeulane paid, we have
not held a public hearing on khts.
pap 39 Joint Meeting, New. 309 197b
Mr: Spencer said to Mr. Macula” that the state "blowsy, dep4*tn"t studied
111ghiway 112 uhi:h has a certain rlgtit-bf-+ray width*, You may haw, a dual
wWituds. Vlkat do you have for traffic? It 'ill affect your zoning. I
am sura there will be qudte a major intersection at, 04949 this will be of
heavy magnitude. It will reflect an the raps. Rove you considered wing
the'exleting Covaty Rood 115? You have grade costs and various other costs
to consider. Bave they been fully evaluated? W14 lteculans said we do not
know, our plan is based on what we do Imov now, which was covered, he said,
by their wall asp. Councilman Kladseth asked if they considered the swamp
area and Mr. Maculans said their engineer feels it is feasible in spite of
Commissioner Ctspmen said in using the new alignment of County Road /15, he
recalls that" It: will carry a fair amount of tFaf f is coming from County Roads
119 and /73, ltr. Spencer asked what volume of traffic ii expected from
I.S. 9494 to Ctuanty Road ILS and to the, ust'of I.q. /494. You can hardly
get along without a four lane facility, Mayor Hilda said we have not had a
traffics study w -de and asked if it is possible to forecast traffic counts
when you change's:igomants such as we have proposed. Mr. KClemenhagen said
we have not been able to sink our teeth into traffic forecasts but can get
them within a year. To get this input is difficult. The Metropolitan Council
will be askin4 for this. The land use information should be pretty well
jelled by then.
Mayor Hilda said we have the land use pretty well figured out for the whole
village but some details depend on roar alig nrtint, so we can settle on a
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pecified land use program around it. We cap cors beck and change the road
alignment and land use, we may go back and forth a n.6ber of times. Tonight
I would like to adopt a reasonably close ,plan to what; It might be,
Councilmen Johnson asked why the County +refoxred the blue line alignment.
Mr. Klemrnhagen said it rovides a more direct' route Bund will saw construction
taste. WO know there Wi l be problems with tho, swamp. We.:eol that you really
do out know about environmental problems. We are looking ht construction costs,
but impact on the neighborhood is not less. Everyone should have alternates.
Leave the situation fluid enough so we can undertake they studies we want.
Mr. Co: said most of the roads are on MIP pvgperty. It has to be econmileally
worthwhile for the interchantes, roads, etc.
Mr.. Klossner said the County'e summarised position as far as County Road /1S
is concerned has two alternates. All things being equal, we run into pro»
blemat developing road* throughout residential ofeas. We try to c-arve the
aosunity anther than the proplArty owner. We a-. not prepared to commit on
the alternate. It will take six months to come'ap with a determin-ion. We
prefer not to construct Countja Road 11S as It :L6, The alto rnote has to be
studied. Wei have no quarrel isith County Road 1611 and could live with '!.
Ths part we cannot live with right now ls, that Ydanetonku. Village and P.Vmuth
do not have 4% comweoa plan. 40 rust have an agretment with both co+omupi'.ties
before we cao plan on an all'gnment through this ares, he brown route requires
very heavy construction. Wfi could go directly straight south as an alternate.
Mayor Hilde 44ked if we sh¢iuld most with the Minx4etonka Village Council and
Planning CoWasion and teltl this we do not care how the blue or brown route
to revsolred, but the County bred* an answer and we should provide one. Planner
Bergly said Minnetonka hate hai a thoroughfare plain since the early 60's and
the council haw not taken any action on it so fear. Mayor Hilda aaki@4 Planter
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Page 4, Jo Int ttes+,.ing9 i. 30;' 1970
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Maaulano it "it r -is . Able that the cpuncil would not make s `,decOloa and he
sold s, yesKlo'W or said we pram no interchanges betwr. Cotety Roads
018 and I.S. 0494. I Serchanges are not 'UWs to strve local areas
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Mayor Hilda Oaid the 4usstioa is the declototi .#de by the Co ity aid Minnetonka
Village. Pluth had decided. Engineer $6=* croo said Pl iuth, *tl l be served
satisfactorily by the brave routs amd we will get ,the right-off`-iwy from IIT.
Basically, w' haus no! problem if we accept it. Wa want to gel mond with our
neighbors. V ate through if we accept tits brown route. j
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Kayor Hilda asked how ashy were in favor of the brow roue .for County Road 061,
All but one
woo
in favor. M'r.,Cav said the interetia age plan at County Roads /
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161 and 015 woo not ('acceptably, to MP. Be, asked if the original plan for
CountyRoad 061 would be resendad at the public hearing* Mayor Hitde said.'itPiy
would trot. Mr.' Cox 'eked if the Control Plan would be followed or liot and/ a
discussion ensued on this.
Mr., Klemw&agen staid the Central was '
submitted
to the Metropolitan Council.
We responded that we could not reXate to it until a total plan was adopted. As
there is going to, be a posture taken we will -say that the central plan;le in
abeyance. The ce%tril plan is obviously being changed so, should be withdrawn
from the Metropolitan Council, Mayor Hilda said we feel the central plan eves
necessary and we have benefitted from the industry it brought in and locatioaa
for the highway de;oartment and civic center. We did go place meal and realised
we were going to rim into this kind of problem and that, -there will undoubtedly
be some changes. but are not willing to say we will put the p1A,n into abeyance.
When we adopt a who plan for the 36 equ+tre miles of Plymouth tia kuoo we will
be making changes &lad updating the plan from time to time and do tarot thick it
will be necessary to scrap the whole, thing.
Mr. Pamperin said we are looking to have soms adjustmout but feel that such a
large intersection ip not necessary, there. We desire it to be where ft is
and we would be willing to give some of the land back to MIP. We would be
willing to go along with a change of alignment. Planner Bergly displayed a
larger map of the County Faade 061 &Ad 015 interchange area and gave the reason
why it was proposed as Is%
A majority of tho group agreed that t're manager should be directed to publial;
the map with the brown alignment, howevery investigate from An engineering
standpoint, moving the road further to the east as much as possible without
jeopardizing this particular alignment.
Mayor Hilde asked if there was an opinion on where the diamond should be located.
Councilman Hintz said he likes Engineer Bonestroo's plan to move it furt'ier nori;h,
It would be to our advantage and be of substantial benefit to Minnetonka.
Couneilain Spaeth asked if a diamond would be adequate, maybe we should go to a
cloverleaf in that area, by eliminating County Road 16 w, will add traffic to
the diamond. In a few years we will have to go to a cloverleaf. kr. Kleawnhap4n
said, if I am sure a diamond interchange is a vital necessity in that area, you
have no access to the cloverleaf from the south. Councilman Watt asked, if we
move it further north will it help the interchange at 165% 0494 and Highway 0552
Mr. Klemenhagen said the state has jurisdiction of I.S. 0494. If the County
allow@ an interchange at County Road 06 then moving it north serves the best
Purpose %
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Maaulano it "it r -is . Able that the cpuncil would not make s `,decOloa and he
sold s, yesKlo'W or said we pram no interchanges betwr. Cotety Roads
018 and I.S. 0494. I Serchanges are not 'UWs to strve local areas
1
Mayor Hilda Oaid the 4usstioa is the declototi .#de by the Co ity aid Minnetonka
Village. Pluth had decided. Engineer $6=* croo said Pl iuth, *tl l be served
satisfactorily by the brave routs amd we will get ,the right-off`-iwy from IIT.
Basically, w' haus no! problem if we accept it. Wa want to gel mond with our
neighbors. V ate through if we accept tits brown route. j
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Kayor Hilda asked how ashy were in favor of the brow roue .for County Road 061,
All but one
woo
in favor. M'r.,Cav said the interetia age plan at County Roads /
I
161 and 015 woo not ('acceptably, to MP. Be, asked if the original plan for
CountyRoad 061 would be resendad at the public hearing* Mayor Hitde said.'itPiy
would trot. Mr.' Cox 'eked if the Control Plan would be followed or liot and/ a
discussion ensued on this.
Mr., Klemw&agen staid the Central was '
submitted
to the Metropolitan Council.
We responded that we could not reXate to it until a total plan was adopted. As
there is going to, be a posture taken we will -say that the central plan;le in
abeyance. The ce%tril plan is obviously being changed so, should be withdrawn
from the Metropolitan Council, Mayor Hilda said we feel the central plan eves
necessary and we have benefitted from the industry it brought in and locatioaa
for the highway de;oartment and civic center. We did go place meal and realised
we were going to rim into this kind of problem and that, -there will undoubtedly
be some changes. but are not willing to say we will put the p1A,n into abeyance.
When we adopt a who plan for the 36 equ+tre miles of Plymouth tia kuoo we will
be making changes &lad updating the plan from time to time and do tarot thick it
will be necessary to scrap the whole, thing.
Mr. Pamperin said we are looking to have soms adjustmout but feel that such a
large intersection ip not necessary, there. We desire it to be where ft is
and we would be willing to give some of the land back to MIP. We would be
willing to go along with a change of alignment. Planner Bergly displayed a
larger map of the County Faade 061 &Ad 015 interchange area and gave the reason
why it was proposed as Is%
A majority of tho group agreed that t're manager should be directed to publial;
the map with the brown alignment, howevery investigate from An engineering
standpoint, moving the road further to the east as much as possible without
jeopardizing this particular alignment.
Mayor Hilde asked if there was an opinion on where the diamond should be located.
Councilman Hintz said he likes Engineer Bonestroo's plan to move it furt'ier nori;h,
It would be to our advantage and be of substantial benefit to Minnetonka.
Couneilain Spaeth asked if a diamond would be adequate, maybe we should go to a
cloverleaf in that area, by eliminating County Road 16 w, will add traffic to
the diamond. In a few years we will have to go to a cloverleaf. kr. Kleawnhap4n
said, if I am sure a diamond interchange is a vital necessity in that area, you
have no access to the cloverleaf from the south. Councilman Watt asked, if we
move it further north will it help the interchange at 165% 0494 and Highway 0552
Mr. Klemenhagen said the state has jurisdiction of I.S. 0494. If the County
allow@ an interchange at County Road 06 then moving it north serves the best
Purpose %
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Peg' S, Joint Meeting, Nov. 30, 1970
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Commissioner Prokket'said the Comty said they do not know where they would go
with the realignment or present aligwent. I'f they elect to upgrade County
Road 015 where it ih, then the present, one As the boot one shown. Mayor Hilde
said r developer has "Id ho can do a iettdr job wVIA dfevelnpment plana where
1t is now. A discussion ensued on tho tem .` tss._bass and what is basttijfot
Plymouth and on the bridge and interchange, Mr. Kagstaha&on said it must be
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submitted to the Metropolitan Council becatae it ie,on an interstate system.
Commissioner Pollock feols it would cut up the area too such. Com dssioner
Kroskin questioned what was actually being; accomrplishad. Engineer Bonestroo
felt the village will not get a diamond on'County Road 015. If you 3o not get
It you ty,ill have to move the alignment ne;kh.
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Mayor R114o said, I feel we are going to Dave now attempts made shortly to
have the hospital built when it is proposed, not only from HIP and the hospital
but also from the citizens. We are beginidng to feel we need medical facilities.
The Metropolitan Council will consider this as a Flus to have the interchange
whero it is and it is free to the public.! Councilman Johnson asked how binding
this Vtll, become after we have a public hjeartng. Will it be a live and die thing?
Mayor Htlde replied it can be altered, noir just on the guide plan, even an the
coning tip. A guide plan is ,dust a guide;. He added that it is not cleat whether
of not -we even had to send our plan to thje:Metropolitan Council, we did it strictly
of our ovo
volitiongir I an not worried about changing the guide plan. Engine4lr
Bonestrao eaid if you once accept the plain it does become important that you
follow it. Any chg6ges require a public jtearing or Planning Commission approval.
Mayor Hilda asked how many were in favor of moving the diamond north to ~there
Engineer Bonestroo indicated. Only one pisrson approved. He asked then how many
wove In favor of waving the diamond wheris it is. The majority were in favor of
this. He asked how many were in favor of'the present alignment of County Road
015 on the east Aide of I.S. 0494 and a imajority were to favor of this.
Mayor Hilde next asked how mann were in flavor of having Pernbrook Lane going
crest and tie in with Harbor Lane as shown or have it swing more easterly to
the rear of the lots on Harbor Lane. Councilman Spaeth suggested it be closer
to I.S. 0494 and avoid Harbor Dene,, Planter Bergly said this plan is only a
concept to show our intent. Mro Klemenhagen said we still want you to abide
by the 1000' for the ramp. Councilmen Hints preferred to haws it drop dam
1000' from the Interchange, Planner Bergly drew in this line and kept Fernbrook
olist of Harbor Lane. A majority were in favor of looping Harbor Lane into
runty Road #15. Commissioner P!rekker suggested making it a service road and
X,-ive the ;tots in a large parcel rather than cutting through theca. Councilman
W. -its suggested that we have the Planner make a practical alignment of County
RoA 11S anal present this at the public hearing instead of presenting the blue
line alignm.,it. The Planner sha,-Ad make a plan for whatever would be the beet.
Cog dssioner 1ollock said if you can order the road away from the ramps, etc%
you can assess the improvement olk both sides. Mayor Hilda asked how many
favc.-ad asking the Planner to wase back with the best plan he can for this and
a va;,ority were in favor.
Plant.• Bergly said that in regctd to the consideration someone wanted regarding
the iop'.ationship of Hig%way 0101 and the Soo Line Industrial Park, the County
has sfi-Aous doubts about any interchanges west of I.S. #494. Many types of
grade .•aparations are a long way off and he pointed these out on a map. It
depends upon development. A cow:,rolled access interchange may be possible.
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TTAffi4ls not great. Provi ing trackage could be a problem. 411roads fisht
cores 4gs as tfd an an ad d;expense. An interchange my halls to be pro- ,
videdtfurther upi It is too isr, off into the future for donslZration neve
A di'
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eualiid on this eu Jeet and the area in, question. !% rjority was
in."f #or of havinj Planner Dergly put in a parallel'road as discussed. ;
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Kayos Hilda said we asked the Planner to change the alignmmat ib the Mapledell
area where it crosses Cdunty Road 124, Planner Bergly ei14 the church needs a
five acre tract and he drew in the proposed alignmsot on the mai which is north
of the church. Coundloan Spaeth preferred to have the westerly end go fu ther
north, in a more stra tht line. Planner Bergly said the curves will not be
extM*. Councilman.'nts said we do not know how it will go until it toml ,
devel ped to- define th% line. Mayor Hilda said this is true of the whale plan.
Counc loran Johnson sale, we know what the intent is and that is the major concern.
Mayor Hilde asked how m ny agreed to go along with the laver parcel drav a in by
the Planner or with Coud:ilman Spaeth's suggestion to straighten out the road
more and move it further away from the residential neighborhood. The majority
were in favor of Planner n4rgly'a proposal.
Planner Bergly said we havf- alternate alignments for West A[edieine Lake Drive.
One is far enough to the west to avoid the evampy area. The other was sect
of the creek and it was pollted out that sooner or later we will have to cross
the creek when we think about extending County Road /6 from Highway #SS.
Engineer Bonestroo said the %,i,cond plan vas cheaper. Mal %r Hilda said he
recalLd the Park Ca®ission'-aying this is a park area and it has a nice
beach. I wonder tf the chespi w plan violates the purpose of the park one
that exists. The Planner race vended that the alignment be vest of the creek.
After some discussion about thk alternate plan and homes in the area a majority
agreed that tLey favored P,lanneft Bergly's recom andation.
Councilman Spaeth feels considetation should be given to make access onto
I.S. #494 from the area 'north of County Road! 147.
With regard to pi.blip hearing dates for the five areas. Planner Bergly was
asked to get the reps and mylars prepared as soon as possible for presentation
to the citieens. Finance Director Barnes was directed to work with the Planner
for these maps and make arrangementg for public hearing facilities, projectors
and placement of same and work out all other details. Publicity to announce
the p:obllc hearing dates wtll be t;ken care of by the press. Mr. Barnes felt
It would take two weeks to make those arrangements&
It was agreed to hold two hearings n January. the 7th and 19th' two in
February and one in March. Mayor H We said the village is proud of the work
that has been put forth on this pl4A}.
MISCELLANEOUS
Councilman Spaeth remarked that there is still a problem on the north end of
Fernbrook Lane .:&used by the Belgarde developtent. Mayor Hilda recoaaanded
that he discuss this with Manager Cranford. Councilman Hints said a lessen
should be learned from thid experiencac by the co=11. In this future more
consideration should be Riven on how the hutldtngs are being located on a
plat plan. The Delmar buildings are too close to the homes. The village
msdN a mistake whee they allowed this construction. Engineer Olson said he
Page 7, Joint : Meeting, Nov. 309 !197
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and the oanager looked at the area 3d he has been $a touch with Mr. Tolgen
regarding the storm sever. The deve oper is trying hard to get it taken
case of
Councillsan Hints said five homes hame been put up for tale in t1e Cavanaugh
Addition, Mayor Hilde told him to call his later this week and make a jrauge-
mants to view this area on Samday. Councilmn Kindseth would like toll`know
If the assessment policy on the storm r has been sstablishad.
Nesting adjourned at 11:00 P.M. z
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Al Hilde, Jr., Mayor
Attest:
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