HomeMy WebLinkAboutCity Council Minutes 05-27-1998ADOPTED MINUTES
SPECIAL COUNCIL MEETING
MAY 279 1998
A special meeting of the Plymouth City Council was called to order by Mayor Tierney at
5:38 PM in the Public Safety Training Room, 3400 Plymouth Blvd., on May 27, 1998.
COUNCIL PRESENT: Mayor Tierney; Councilmembers Bildsoe Johnson, and Preus.
Councilmember Wold arrived at 5:45 PM. Councilmember Spigner arrived at 5:50 PM.
ABSENT: Councilmember Black.
PLYMOUTH STAFF PRESENT: City Manager Johnson, Assistant Manager Lueckert,
Public Works Director Moore, and Deputy City Clerk Hoffman.
ORONO COUNCIL PRESENT: Mayor Gabriel Jabbour, Councilmembers Richard
Flint, Charles Kelley, and Barbara Peterson.
ORONO STAFF PRESENT: City Administrator Ronald Moorse, Public Service Director
Greg Gappa
Item I Ferndale Road Improvements from Co. Rd. 6 to Hwy. 12, City Project
6007
Public Works Director Moore outlined the history of the project. He explained
the Orono city annexation of a portion of Ferndale Road right-of-way from
Wayzata, so that state aid qualifications could be met. He said that funding for
the project is budgeted in capital improvements program in both cities. He
said that urban street standards were opted for rather than rural, because
creation of ditches would have created environmental problems. He explained
the three road width options, including options for turn lanes, and the
engineering staff recommendations for curb and gutter. He said that in order to
meet state standards, the trail on the east side of the road would have to be ten
feet wide. He said that if the trail were less than ten feet wide, it would not
meet state aid standards, but that would not affect a request for state aid for the
road, since the two would be considered separately.
Councilmember Wold arrived at 5:45 PM.
Director Moore explained that a state -level committee meets three times a
year to consider requests for variances in state aid guidelines, if Orono and
Plymouth decide on further options. He said that approval on the state level of
any variance requests would be needed before the state aid office would
approve a plan.
Adopted City Council Minutes
May 27, 1998
Page 2
Mayor Jabbour said the city could make the path a six-foot sidewalk, which
would meet requirements, and later make a wider trail. He said there are many
ways to get what the cities want, and it is a matter of approaching it with a
different philosophy.
Director Moore said a concrete sidewalk would cost about 33% more. He said
it would be impractical to do an asphalt sidewalk at that width. He said staff
would have to explore the technicalities of state descriptions to come up with
P0 MIR IIAVATN A
Director Moore said that all width options would include the maximum road
curvature, meandering within the right-of-way to discourage speeding of
traffic, while considering protection of trees along the route.
Councilmember Flint said the uneven path creates an unevenness over city
boundaries which needs to be addressed.
Councilmember Spigner arrived at 5:50 PM.
Councilmember Kelley said the road widths he saw in sketches were
stretching beyond the aesthetics he wanted to see for Orono. He said he was
opposed to how urban the roads are becoming around Orono, and said he is
also opposed to increased speed levels. He said a question to consider is the
purpose of the road, and whether it should be used as a traffic feeder to
Wayzata.
Mayor Jabbour said that the cost of the road is a major consideration for
Orono residents, who have been unhappy with the costs of a sewer upgrade.
He said that now Orono officials are concerned with the use of three years
worth of Orono's state roads allocation to fix Ferndale Road. He said he was
in support of a narrower road, but would go along with a plan for a 28 -foot
road because it was the right thing to do financially.
Councilmember Preus said that he did not see a need for a road wider than 28
feet and no need for a 10 -foot bike path unless it is a state requirement.
Councilmember Bildsoe stated that he was in favor of a 28 -foot road with no
turn lanes and no marked bike lane. He said he believes no separation looks
better. He said he would also support surmountable curbing, rather than
vertical.
Adopted City Council Minutes
May 27, 1998
Page 3
Councilmember Johnson said residents who she had heard from are concerned
with keeping the asphalt away from their yards, and keeping curbs and
boulevards to a minimum.
Director Moore said it would be most practical to put the trail on curb because
of properties, and the standard for state aid would be a 10 -foot trail.
Councilmember Preus said he did want to accept a ten -foot standard as
something that must be done, unless it was a state standard which must be
complied with. He said he would support any effort to make the trail smaller.
Councilmember Bildsoe said under the present conditions, any width trail
would be a major improvement.
Director Moore said he would include in his report clarifications on what
standards and variances could be applied.
Director Moore said the rolling terrain would be kept, and only the steepest
hill will be cut, so that the road will meet 30 mph design standards. He said
Plymouth would propose a 30 mph speed limit. If either city is challenged, the
state would do a study.
Councilmember Wold said he intended to vote for a 30 mph speed limit.
Mayor Jabbour said efforts should be made to build the road to standards that
would make it difficult for the state to raise speed limits.
Director Moore explained that vertical curbing is recommended since
Ferndale Road is a collector street with higher traffic volumes.
Councilmember Flint said he supported the vertical curbing recommendation,
because some sort of protection is needed for pedestrians and bicyclists
because of the road design.
Councilmember Bildsoe said he would support surmountable curbing, because
he did not believe the trail would give cyclists the opportunity to get off the
road quickly.
Councilmember Johnson said she liked vertical curbing as a means to keep
pedestrians away from traffic. She said she also believed it would limit
chances for cars to pass on the right.
Councilmember Flint said he believed serious bikers will go on the roadway,
but recreational bikers and those cyclists with children will be up on the trail.
Adopted City Council Minutes
May 27, 1998
Page 4
Councilmember Kelley left the meeting at 6:26 PM.
Mayor Tierney said that in reviewing cost sharing, Orono would go on a
50-50 cost split including the trail up to the Luce Line.
Mayor Jabbour explained the MSA standards needed to qualify for road funds.
He said all Orono roads are up to MSA standards, but that improvements on
Ferndale Road would require all the city's MSA funding for three years.
Director Moore said that Orono will get more MSA money on Ferndale Road
than Plymouth because of more of the right-of-way is in Orono. He said
money received each year does not necessarily correspond to a desired project,
because the money is allocated to cities based on state standards for
improvement needs. He said that if Orono did not have Femdale Road on the
list for several years, the city would not draw that money. He said the State
would pay each city for the percentage of road on their system, and each city
may ultimately be writing checks to each other to cover expenses.
Manager Johnson left the meeting at 6:37 PM.
Administrator Moorse and Councilmember Flint left the meeting at 6:38 PM.
Director Moore said the proposed cost of the bikeway would be completely
paid by Plymouth. He said that if the total project split was based on city
boundaries, the cost would come out to be Orono's share at 60%, and
Plymouth's at 40%, but with Plymouth covering the bike path expenses, the
Plymouth portion is brought up to 44%. He said staff felt Plymouth should
pay for the trail since it lies within Plymouth boundaries, even though it would
be used by both cities.
Councilmember Wold said the issues are not black and white, but he would be
willing to see Plymouth pay for 50% of the project as a debt of gratitude for
Orono's efforts to annex the road in an effort to gain MSA funding.
Councilmember Preus said he believed the project should be viewed as a
project of both cities and reviewed as a whole and have some means of
looking at the increased amount of MSA funding that Orono will receive for
the project.
Mayor Jabbour said that Orono's motion on the project places them actively in
the project with Plymouth, having a common goal to fix the road. He said it
will be easier not to debate numbers.
Adopted City Council Minutes
May 27, 1998
Page 5
Mayor Tierney directed Plymouth staff to present a scenario for next council
meeting.
Item II Amusement License
Motion was made by Councilmember Wold, seconded by Councilmember
Preus, to adopt RESOLUTION 98-332 APPROVING 1998
AMUSEMENT LICENSE FOR GOPHER STATE EXPOSITIONS, INC.
Motion carried, six ayes.
Motion was made by Councilmember Wold, seconded by Councilmember Preus, to
adjourn the meeting at 7:08 PM. Motion carried, six ayes.
Kurt Hof
Deputy City Clerk