HomeMy WebLinkAboutPlanning Commission Minutes 11-20-2002Approved Minutes
City of Plymouth
Planning Commission Meeting
November 20, 2002
MEMBERS PRESENT: Chairman Karl Neset, Commissioners David Gaither, Jason Rohloff,
Frank Weir, James Holmes, Kendall Griffith and Peggy Larson
MEMBERS ABSENT: None
STAFF PRESENT: Community Development Director Anne Hurlburt, Planning Manager
Barbara Senness, City Engineer Ron Quanbeck, Senior Planner Marie Darling, Planner Rebecca
Bowers, Associate Planner Josh Doty, and Office Support Representative Janice Bergstrom
1. CALL TO ORDER - 7:00 P.M.
2. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
3. PUBLIC FORUM
4. APPROVAL OF AGENDA
MOTION by Chairman Neset, seconded by Commissioner Larson, to approve the
November 20, 2002 Planning Commission Agenda. Vote. 7 Ayes. MOTION approved.
5. APPROVAL OF MINUTES
MOTION by Chairman Neset, seconded by Commissioner Rohloff, to approve the November 6,
2002 Planning Commission Minutes. Vote. 6 Ayes. Commissioner Griffith abstained.
MOTION approved.
6. CONSENT AGENDA
A. MICHAEL STIEGLER AND SONJA SAVRE (2002139)
MOTION by Chairman Neset, seconded by Commissioner Griffith, to approve the request by
Michael Stiegler and Sonya Savre to approve a variance to allow the placement of a 5 -foot
privacy fence in a front yard, where 3 feet is the maximum height allowed for a privacy fence in a
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
November 20, 2002
Page 2
front yard for property located at 4115 Forestview Lane North. Vote. 7 Ayes. MOTION
approved.
7. PUBLIC HEARINGS
A. WAYZATA PUBLIC SCHOOLS (2002107)
Chairman Neset introduced the request by Wayzata Public Schools for a site plan amendment and
conditional use permit to allow a 66 -foot by 104 -foot accessory building to be located south of
the ice arena at Central Middle School, 305 Vicksburg Lane North.
Associate Planner Doty gave an overview of the November 12, 2002 staff report.
Chairman Neset introduced Joe Matson, 17305 19th Avenue North, the applicant for the project,
who offered to answer any questions regarding the request.
Chairman Neset opened the public hearing. Chairman Neset closed the public hearing as no one
was present to speak on the item.
MOTION by Commissioner Gaither, seconded by Commissioner Weir, to approve the request
for a site plan amendment and conditional use permit to allow a 66 -foot by 104 -foot accessory
building to be located south of the ice arena at Central Middle School, 305 Vicksburg Lane
North. Roll Call Vote. 7Ayes. MOTION approved unanimously.
B. THE ROTTLUND COMPANY (2002132)
Chairman Neset introduced the request by Rottlund Company for a planned unit development
amendment to allow 23 -foot front yard setbacks for two single family homes to be constructed at
14100 55th Avenue North and 14100 54th Avenue North in the Reserve Second Addition.
Planner Bowers gave an overview of the November 12, 2002 staff report.
Chairman Neset opened the public hearing.
Chairman Neset introduced Dustin Kern, representing The Rottlund Co. Mr. Kern apologized for
the problem resulting from an initial oversight and stated he does concur with staff
recommendations.
Chairman Neset opened the public hearing.
Chairman Neset introduced Steve Gardner, 10717 10th Avenue North. Mr. Gardner said he
addressed The Reserve project 2 years ago at a Planning Commission meeting and said that
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
November 20, 2002
Page 3
Rottlund Co. stated at that time there would be affordable apartments. In referencing the Village
at Bassett Creek, Mr. Gardner stated that Rottlund cut trees before they presented any plans to
the City so they would not have to pay restitution to the City. Mr. Gardner said he has observed
that no black dirt is placed under sod at The Reserve which results in a runoff problem. The City
then had to buy water from Maple Grove and the City of Plymouth residents are drinking
untreated water.
Director Hurlburt interjected that there is no unsafe water going to taps in the City.
Mr. Gardner continued that he has a receipt from Maple Grove for 113 million gallons of water
that the City of Plymouth bought from the City of Maple Grove and said that water is not treated
when it comes to Plymouth. Mr. Gardner said a good landscaper will add 4-6" of black dirt under
sod. Mr. Gardner noted that recently residents were denied a 2' variance for a sunroom, a pool
too close to a wetland was denied, and a homeowner wanting to build cabinets in a garage as a
business was denied. Mr. Gardner asked that the Planning Commission not grant a variance when
this developer does not do very nice things for him as a City of Plymouth resident. Mr. Gardner
wants the Planning Commission to treat everyone fairly whether it's a developer or someone
wanting a 2' variance for a sunroom.
Chairman Neset closed the public hearing.
Mr. Kern stated that, North American Properties, not Rottlund Homes, is the current property
owner of the apartment site in The Reserve. Rottlund Homes had no interest nor cut down any of
the trees at Basset Creek Village and stated this is a false accusation. Mr. Kern said that 4-6" of
black dirt is the typically placed before sodding and he said he will confirm that with the
production people on site.
Director Hurlburt stated that Rottlund never promised that The Reserve apartments would be
affordable. After discussions with North American Properties it was deemed financially
unfeasible. Director Hurlburt stated that Rottlund did not renege on any promises. Director
Hurlburt said they did commit to 20% of the homes in The Reserve to be affordable and have
worked diligently to make homes affordable and available for first time homebuyers. Director
Hurlburt said she does not want to see Rottlund Homes maligned because they have provided
affordable housing in this community. Director Hurlburt addressed the issue of the water supply
being untreated and stated this is a gross exaggeration of what occurred. During a peak time the
City of Plymouth purchased water from the City of Maple Grove. This water may not have had
the iron and manganese removed, but it was chlorinated and not unsafe.
MOTION by Commissioner Gaither, seconded by Commissioner Larson, to approve the request
by The Rottlund Company, Inc. for a PUD amendment to allow 23 -foot front yard setbacks for
two single family homes in Phase Two of The Reserve located west of I-494 and north of the
Canadian Pacific Railroad. Roll Call Vote. 7 Ayes. MOTION approved unanimously.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
November 20, 2002
Page 4
8. NEW BUSINESS
A. RTS INVESTMENTS (2002138)
Chairman Neset introduced the proposal by RTS Investments for a sketch plan including
alternative wetland buffers for a 35 -unit condominium building to be known as "Marshview
Senior Condominiums" for property located at 17320 State Highway 55.
Senior Planner Darling gave an overview of the November 12, 2002 staff report.
Chairman Neset introduced Gary Vogel, architect with BKV Group. Mr. Vogel said he feels
there is a demand for a senior condo project and they already have a half dozen interested
purchasers for these upscale units. Mr. Vogel said that for the design of their building they have
followed the delineated wetland edge except for a 2800 square foot area which could be mitigated
on site. Mr. Vogel suggested that additional wetlands could be filled and additional buffer area
created. If the alternative buffers were not acceptable, they would be willing to mitigate at a 3:1
ratio. Mr. Vogel acknowledged there would be only one entrance into the site and stated that
MnDOT has no problem with that. Mr. Vogel said there have been many meetings with staff and
they have reviewed other proposals for turnarounds, townhouse vs. condos, and the frontage road
issue. Mr. Vogel said even if a frontage road were permitted, the cost would be prohibitive to the
cost of building this project. He said the property would not connect to trails but said the tot lot
would offer an play area for visiting children.
Chairman Neset introduced Robert T. Schmidt, developer, who said if this proposal is not
approved, they want direction from the Planning Commission on how to develop this piece of
land which he feels is a pretty piece of land. Mr. Schmidt stated that a tremendous amount of
time, money and energy has been spent on trying to develop this piece of land. He said the best
direction he can get from staff is to find someone who wants to use it for wetland mitigation or a
single family dwelling, but Mr. Schmidt stated he feels the senior condo building would be an
asset to the community, and is convinced it could work for the City, the owner and the developer.
Chairman Neset introduced John Gateley, 3937 Garland Lane North. Mr. Gateley stated his
backyard looks out over this wetland. Mr. Gateley said the Hennepin County Conservation
District, which measures health of wetlands, had rated this wetland as excellent in 1998. The
quality and present bio -diversity has only gotten better, and he saw a muskrat house this summer.
Mr. Gateley urged care if they are changing any part of it and stated this wetland provides a lot of
entertainment now.
Chairman Neset commented that he likes the proposed project, but has reservations regarding the
location. He also stated that he felt this proposal is not what is set forth in the Comprehensive
Plan. Chairman Neset said traffic access problems would be created with no frontage road and
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
November 20, 2002
Page 5
there would be no pedestrian access. Chairman Neset said he would support this property being
kept as a wetland or single family homes.
Commissioner Rohloff asked what other options staff has suggested to the developer.
Senior Planner Darling said staff has met many times with the applicant and other developers who
have posed potential uses for the site. The poor vehicle and pedestrian access, isolation from all
adjacent properties and limited land area were reasons the property was changed to residential. A
single family home or wetland mitigation was recommended.
Commissioner Gaither echoed Chairman Neset's concerns, in particular the traffic safety issue.
He also added that it seems that they are trying to put 10 lbs. into a 5 lb. bag. Mr. Gaither said
ultimately this is not the most developable piece of land, and to leave the property as is.
Commissioner Gaither said he cannot visualize a high end single family project on this site.
Planning Manager Senness reaffirmed this is a difficult site to work with but noted she had just
had an inquiry from a wetland banking business interested in the site. Planning Manager Senness
said there is definitely an economic value for sites like this, albeit a less traditional use of the land.
Commissioner Gaither stated that his advice would be to approach it logically - not to fight this,
but work with the actual contours of the property might make economic sense.
Mr. Vogel responded to Commissioner Gaither that the cost of the land is far in excess of what
anyone could pay for wetland mitigation, and is part of the reason they are trying to find some
density in developing the property. He said they are still looking for another alternative to present
to the Planning Commission.
Commissioner Larson echoed concerns of traffic and said she understands the landowner wants to
get as much out of the land as possible, but if conditions exist that you can't get around you must
employ damage control. Commissioner Larson noted that Dundee Nursery can only be accessed
and exited from the westbound lane of Highway 55. Commissioner Larson said she feels that
would be a tremendous problem for a project with high density.
Chairman Neset introduced Scott Dahlke, project engineer. Mr. Dahlke said he realizes that
traffic would be main issue for an isolated parcel but the single access was alright with MnDOT.
Mr. Dahlke said that MnDOT has given different feedback than the City which increased their
confidence in developing the project. Mr. Dahlke questioned if there is such a strong demand for
wetland mitigation banking. Approvals usually occur with wetland mitigation occurring on site.
Chairman Neset introduced Lance Novak, 17035 41st Place North. Mr. Novak stated his property
backs up to this wetland, which is one of the greatest wetlands we have. Mr. Novak said he owns
two acres, but was only able to build less than one acre because of the wetland. Mr. Novak stated
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
November 20, 2002
Page 6
that a developer should put something that fits properly on these acres without damaging the large
wetland which is great for the wildlife, which includes numerous muskrat houses and an 8 -point
buck, in the area.
Commissioner Gaither asked how long the current landowner has owned this property.
Mr. Schmidt responded that Mr. Swigart has owned this for 40 years and pointed out that the
trailer has been removed and the property has been cleaned up. He added they would not disrupt
the wetland, instead they propose to open it up and allow seniors to wander out into it. The
building would view the wetland. Mr. Schmidt said it has been frustrating trying to find a lower
density use and said one of the difficulties with a single family home is the cost of providing the
loop water main.
Chairman Neset introduced Brian Ranney, 3995 Garland Lane North, who stated his property
also backs up to the wetland, which is a beautiful area and the only reason he bought his lot. Mr.
Ranney stated the value of the property is what it is zoned for. Mr. Ranney stated that the upland
areas on the site where the applicant would provide mitigation contain the majority of the trees
and feels this project would damage the eco -system as a whole.
Commissioner Griffith stated that this project is too dense for the area. Commissioner Larson
echoed Commissioner Griffith's concern and noted that suggestions have been made regarding the
use of this piece of land and said the applicant is not willing to accept the answer that has been
offered. Commissioner Larson said she will support denying this use.
Mr. Vogel asked if there would be an inkling of support for this same site other than wetland
mitigation or single family, such as a townhouse concept with density significantly lowered.
Director Hurlburt responded that staff would not be supportive of any variances necessary to
develop this site. Director Hurlburt recapped the issues of buffers and total disconnection from
the City's street and trail systems. Director Hurlburt noted that State Highway 55 eventually will
be increased to 6 lanes and the traffic situation will not improve. Director Hurlburt stated
although MnDOT would not deny access for a development at this site now, that should not be
taken as an endorsement of any project as that decision will be made by the City of Plymouth.
Planning Manager Senness added the pedestrian access is a problem regardless of the population.
Commissioner Weir stated he is opposed to the proposal strictly because of the single access on to
Highway 55.
MOTION by Commissioner Gaither, seconded by Commissioner Weir, recommending denying
the use of alternative wetland buffers and providing informal comments for a 35 -unit
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
November 20, 2002
Page 7
condominium building to be known as "Marshview Senior Condominiums" for property located at
17320 State Highway 55. Roll Call Vote. 7 Ayes. MOTION approved unanimously.
B. CITY OF PLYMOUTH
MOTION by Commissioner Larson, seconded by Commissioner Rohloff, to approve the 2003
Planning Commission meeting schedule. Vote. 6 Ayes. Commissioner Gaither abstained.
9. ADJOURNMENT
MOTION by Chairman Neset, seconded by Commissioner Rohloff, to adjourn the meeting.
Vote. 7 Ayes. The meeting adjourned at 8:15 p.m.