HomeMy WebLinkAboutPlanning Commission Minutes 04-21-2010Approved Minutes
City of Plymouth
Planning Commission Meeting
April 21, 2010
MEMBERS PRESENT: Chair James Davis, Commissioners Nathan Robinson, Erik Aamoth,
Scott Nelson, Dick Kobussen and Marc Anderson
MEMBERS ABSENT: Commissioner Gordon Petrash
STAFF PRESENT: Planning Manager Barbara Senness, Senior Planner Shawn Drill, Senior
Planner Joshua Doty, Water Resources Manager Asche and Office Support Representative Janice
Bergstrom
1. CALL TO ORDER - 7:00 P.M.
2. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
3. PUBLIC FORUM
4. APPROVAL OF AGENDA
MOTION by Commissioner Nelson, seconded by Commissioner Kobussen, to approve the
April 21, 2010 amended Planning Commission Agenda. Vote. 6 Ayes. MOTION approved.
5. CONSENT AGENDA
A. APPROVAL OF THE MARCH 17, 2010 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
MINUTES
MOTION by Commissioner Robinson, seconded by Commissioner Kobussen, to approve the
March 17, 2010 Planning Commission Minutes. Vote. 6 Ayes. MOTION approved.
6. PUBLIC HEARINGS
A. CARLSON REAL ESTATE COMPANY (2010024)
Chair Davis introduced the request by Carlson Real Estate Company for a rezoning and PUD
general plan for the existing daycare located at 13905 County Road 6.
Senior Planner Doty gave an overview of the staff report.
Planning Commissioner Kobussen said when this property was divided a variance was approved
to allow public access. He asked if there would be any problems with that variance when selling
to another user.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 2
Senior Planner Doty said there is no issue with the variance, as the access is with a private
easement to the property and would remain in force.
Chair Davis introduced the applicant, Debra Altschuler, 301 Carlson Parkway. Ms. Altschuler
said Senior Planner Doty accurately summed up the situation. She said there is some dispute
with the prospective purchaser regarding whether or not the use is non -conforming.
Consequently the purchaser does not want to proceed with out the rezoning.
Chair Davis opened and closed the public hearing as there was no one present to speak on the
item.
Planning Commissioner Nelson asked if the city would have more flexibility if the use ever
changed if the property is rezoned to PUD.
Senior Planner Doty said the PUD zoning would be consistent with the I-2 zoning on this
property. Planning Manager Senness added any I-2 conditional use would require a PUD
amendment which would allow a little more flexibility than the I-2 zoning.
MOTION by Commissioner Anderson, seconded by Commissioner Nelson, to approve the
request by Carlson Real Estate Company for a rezoning and PUD general plan for the existing
daycare located at 13905 County Road 6. Roll Call Vote. 6 Ayes. MOTION approved
unanimously.
B. CITY OF PLYMOUTH (2010025)
Chair Davis introduced the request by the City of Plymouth for a zoning ordinance amendment
relating to non-commercial signs.
Senior Planner Drill gave an overview of the staff report.
Commissioner Robinson asked if the proposed zoning amendment would affect non-commercial
signs other than campaign signage, such as "Support the Troops" signs.
Senior Planner Drill responded that the amendment would apply to all non-commercial signs,
including campaign signs and other signs with non-commercial messages such as "Support the
Troops." He noted that during the revised time period specified by the state, cities cannot limit
the size or number of non-commercial signs.
Planning Commissioner Kobussen asked what would happen if the city denies the proposed
amendment.
Senior Planner Drill said that the state's new sign regulation would still apply if the city denies it,
because state law supersedes local regulations. He clarified that the purpose of the amendment is
simply to maintain consistency between our ordinance and the new state law.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 3
Planning Manager Senness added this zoning amendment is being undertaken at the
recommendation of the city attorney.
MOTION by Commissioner Nelson, seconded by Commissioner Kobussen, to approve the
request by the City of Plymouth for a zoning ordinance amendment relating to non-commercial
signs. Roll Call Vote. 6 Ayes. MOTION approved unanimously.
7. NEW BUSINESS
A. CITY OF PLYMOUTH
Chair Davis introduced the request by the City of Plymouth for an environmental assessment
worksheet for Plymouth Creek stream bank improvements.
Water Resources Manager Asche gave an overview of the staff report.
Planning Commissioner Anderson said the mention of rip rap conjures pictures of things he has
seen over the years, and asked if cobblestone or broken pieces of concrete would be used.
Water Resources Manager Asche said city specifications propose granite chunks. He said it
would have a jagged, rough look and would disrupt and slow down water flow to help prevent
erosion.
Planning Commissioner Anderson asked for an explanation of the 1.5 year flow.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the 1.5 year flow is being used for purposes of the EAW
and design of best management practices (BMP) to determine what effect it has on the creek and
what kind of practices to apply. He said some areas are flatter with less velocity and an
engineered design would not be necessary, while other areas have severe damage and erosion
based on soil type and slope.
Planning Commissioner Anderson asked where the ponds would be built.
Water Resources Manage Asche said the excavation portion of the Plymouth Creek water quality
pond project was constructed over the winter with restoration to start soon, and the bridge
placement also needs to take place in the ponds. He said they propose to take the ponds and the
stream bank restoration and meld together to restore the creek. Water Resources Manager Asche
said the water would flow to the ponds for treatment for a one-two punch for water quality
protection. Water Resources Manager Asche displayed a draft proposal to meander the creek
and then join with the water quality ponds. He said aerials, provided by Hennepin County, could
be available in 6-7 months.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 4
Planning Commissioner Anderson asked if there are any calculations on the water quality and
reduction in phosphorous.
Water Resources Manage Asche said a total maximum daily load (TMDL) study is being done
on Medicine Lake by the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency (MPGA) to determine how much
phosphorous the lake can assimilate and still meet water quality standards. The estimate is the
pond would remove 500 pounds of phosphorous from Plymouth Creek every year. The creek
restoration was modeled in conjunction with the proposed ponds, and the total of the two
combined would be 895 pounds of phosphorous removed. Water Resources Manager Asche
reiterated this is modeling, not monitoring data. He stressed this is important because the draft
Medicine Lake TMDL study indicates 1,280 pounds of total phosphorous removal is needed.
Water Resources Manager Asche said between the ponds and this project, 75% of this goal
would be achieved.
Planning Commissioner Kobussen asked why trees are being removed.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the current tree canopies result in a limited amount of
undergrowth that can establish to hold soil. A root structure in place holds the soil as the water
comes through. He said the difficulty here is balancing tree removal with allowing sun light in.
Water Resources Manager Asche said we don't want to clear cut the existing stream channel, but
need sunlight to grow grasses, dogwoods, willow, etc. to establish root structure.
Water Resources Manager Asche clarified that 2012 is referring to final stabilization of the
stream channel portion in the wetland area. The planting and re -vegetation of the erosion
sedimentation portion would be in 2011. Water Resources Manager Asche said they propose to
keep the channel off-line for one year to allow for restoration before allowing flows from
Plymouth Creek. He said a berm would be constructed to allow the creek to temporarily
maintain its existing flow, but not flow directly into the newly constructed channel. He added
that if the vegetation does not properly establish, the purpose of the project is defeated if erosion
is allowed to occur. Water Resources Manager Asche said in 2012 the berm would be removed
to let the water through.
Planning Commissioner Kobussen asked about the likelihood of the Blanding's turtles being
present in this area.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the Minnesota Heritage data base indicates Blanding's
turtle, a protected species, within one mile of the area. Water Resources Manager Asche said
neither he nor staff, who are regularly on site, has seen them. He said special precautions for
protection, such as gaps in fencing and education to contractors, would be implemented to avoid
impact on Blanding's turtles if they are present.
Commissioner Nelson asked how the 75 feet from the center of creek measurement was arrived
at.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 5
Water Resources Manager Asche said he picked this number and felt it would be sufficient for
the consultant to work with. He clarified that the tagged trees are for location purposes only and
added that not even half of the trees tagged are proposed in the construction area.
Planning Commissioner Nelson said tree replacement guidelines are in effect for developments
approved by the city. He asked if such guidelines are in effect for this project.
Planning Manager Senness said when a property is platted, the tree replacement policy applies,
and that is not what is happening here. She added that we are interested in not removing any
more trees than necessary. She concurred with Water Resources Manager Asche regarding
working with the neighborhood and reviewing any trees that are causing issues.
Planning Commissioner Nelson said he is concerned about screening of the industrial area. He
said reducing the amount of trees would affect sounds and visual impact, and asked about
regulations for screening and the noise ordinance for areas that are buffeted from the industrial
area.
Planning Manager Senness said when development occurs we review ordinances to ensure
proper buffering, but not in a situation such as this.
Planning Commissioner Nelson asked about the budgeting and if the funding has been approved.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the Bassett Creek Watershed funding has been approved;
a grant the city received from Hennepin County will be before the City Council April 27, 2010.
Planning Commissioner Nelson asked if they anticipate having to prioritize parts of this project.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the next set of plans will provide a better idea of quantities
and the cost of the project to determine if the funding will be adequate to do the entire stream
corridor. He said there is a possibility we can only repair the worst areas.
Chair Davis introduced Brad Nelson, 12825 30th Avenue N. Mr. Nelson said he lives upstream
of the proposed renovations and said it sounds like a great plan. Mr. Nelson's financial lending
institution recently told him his home of 30 years is in a flood plain. Mr. Nelson said the
engineering staff was very helpful and informed him that FEMA had redrawn maps. Mr. Nelson
said he is hopeful this project might change the flood plain to improve the upper part of the
development as well.
Chair Davis introduced Barbara Mitchell, 12840 28th Avenue N. Ms. Mitchell said she has 27
trees tagged in her back yard, and if even half are removed it will concern her. She asked when
the neighbors would know which trees are being removed and if each tree is assessed on an
individual basis. She added there is plenty of light and she has her vegetable garden by the
creek.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 6
Chair Davis introduced John Graves, 12850 28th Avenue N. Mr. Graves said his home and
business are on both sides of the creek and asked if the city legally can go on both sides. Mr.
Graves said 20 years ago the city dredged the creek, built a 6 -foot berm which is still there, and
nothing grew for two years. He said he doesn't think he wants to have them on his property at
all if that's the way it works.
Chair Davis introduced Jake Ziebarth, 2715 Sycamore Lane N. Mr. Ziebarth thanked Water
Resources Manager Asche and said he has been incredibly informative. Mr. Ziebarth said this is
a tough issue, and invited all to come to his back yard which is his piece of paradise and why this
neighborhood doesn't need cabins. Mr. Ziebarth said the woods buffer the entire neighborhood
from three major roadways: I-494, State Highway 55 and Northwest Boulevard. Mr. Ziebarth
said his property has two major cliffs that put a lot of sediment into the stream and Medicine
Lake which need to be dealt with. Mr. Ziebarth said there is amazing diversification of this
creek and asked if the city could "tenderly" come in to remove the trees. Mr. Ziebarth said the
plan indicates trees only 8" and bigger, but smaller trees would come out with the big ones. Mr.
Ziebarth said he likes the proposed natural restoration and wants something to shore up the creek
in his area to keep it from running out rather than removing so much of the woods. He asked
what could be done to tier the banks back without having to remove the buffer which screens the
three office buildings. He said there are trucks, garbage haulers, loading docks and semi's. Mr.
Ziebarth said he has lived there 45 years and recalled when the buildings were constructed the
trees were the buffer on the original plan. He said he realizes the city's hands are tied and the
lake sediment is not passing state requirements. Mr. Ziebarth asked if there are penalties and
fines for not meeting state requirements. He asked if there could be segmentation of this
renovation. He said the ponding done by Medicine Lake has lessened sediment. Mr. Ziebarth
concluded that something needs to be done, but he doesn't want to give up the woods to see it
done.
Chair Davis introduced Eric Williams, 2217 Oakview Lane N. Mr. Williams stated Plymouth
Creek does not look like any of the photos shown. He said in August there is no Plymouth
Creek. Mr. Williams said Water Resources Manager Asche has been very helpful, but it is
worrisome to all the neighbors. Mr. Williams said he does not want the scope of this project to
start off more grandiose than it needs to be.
Planning Manager Senness asked if the renovation would have an effect on flood plain zoning.
Water Resources Manager Asche said this project would not change any of the flood plain
elevations with Mr. Nelson's home or property. He said they would not be holding back any
water to create a larger flood plain nor lowering any elevation to reduce the elevation of the
floodplain.
Chair Davis asked what body of water caused the flood plain designation.
Water Resources Manager Asche said Mr. Nelson is adjacent to a large wetland on the north
edge of the proposed project. An outlet structure had been placed to control some of the velocity
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 7
of water leaving that wetland. In 2004 or 2006 FEMA reissued flood plain maps showing a
wider area of flood plain.
Planning Manager Senness said staff could review the elevation in that area. A map amendment
could be done if it appears Mr. Nelson's property is not in a flood zone.
Planning Manager Senness asked when the determination would be made on tree removal.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the current 50% draft plan does not give a very good idea
which trees would be proposed for removal. When all the comments are received on the EAW
worksheet, the city's engineering consultant will address those issues for the project. A meeting
is anticipated for the end of May at which time they would be able to look more definitively at
the trees. Water Resources Manager Asche recommended subscribing to the e-mail alerts.
Water Resources Manager Asche said he would like to meet with Ms. Mitchell to discuss her
situation prior to that meeting.
Planning Manager Senness asked if the city would be able to work on both sides of the creek.
Water Resources Manager Asche said some portions of the creek lie on city property and others
are on private property with easements which establish the right to work there. Those portions
that are neither easement nor public property on the lower section of the creek present a problem.
This project is unique and if any resident determines they don't want any work done there, they
need to make that known so we don't design for that area.
Planning Manager Senness asked about today's restoration process compared to twenty years
ago.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the drainage work twenty years ago was for controlling
water from point A to point B, with berming and piping commonly used. He said through the
Clean Water Act and additional mandates, approaches to projects have changed. Berming can
still be a part of a project but you end up with very different proposed solutions than we had in
the past. Water Resources Manager Asche reiterated that the intent with the proposed stream
restoration is to leave it ecologically better than we found it, while trying to minimize the tree
loss as we move forward with something more ecologically sound.
Planning Manager Senness said staff could review the original approval for the industrial
buildings and the buffering.
Water Resources Manager Asche said Mr. Ziebarth has expressed concern about noise and
screening of the commercial area. He said the consultant is looking at placement of a berm that
would help with screening and additional plantings near Mr. Ziebarth's house and north of 26th
Avenue.
Approved
Planning Commission Minutes
April 21, 2010
Page 8
Planning Manager Senness asked if the scope of the project fits the actual conditions of the
existing stream.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the ultimate goal for the city is to demonstrate to other
regulatory agencies completion of projects to meet state standards. He said a nearby
municipality was fined for not complying with a permit to discharge storm water. He said the
city does need to do projects to reduce phosphorous loading into Medicine Lake. This project
would get us most of the way there. If the scope of this project were reduced, or the modeling
indicates something different than expected, the city would be responsible to do other projects to
meet the goals.
Water Resources Manager Asche clarified that the photos on the handout do not represent
Plymouth Creek; they are examples of best management practices. He reiterated there would be
a number of trees removed, but it would not be a clear-cut leaving vast open areas, and not
leaving a naked channel from top to bottom.
Planning Commissioner Aamoth asked if the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency indicated a
timeline or gave guidance for this project, and what would they consider to be progress.
Water Resources Manager Asche said the MPCA is supportive of projects that reduce
phosphorous loading and increase water quality. He said there is concern that work in the
wetland might alter the wetland area in some way. He said between the MPCA, Army Corps of
Engineers and the Minnesota DNR, monitoring wells have been installed to monitor hydrology.
Planning Commissioner Anderson said he is seeing a project with tremendous merit that is
designed to improve water quality and reduce flooding. Commissioner Anderson said sufficient
communication and information have been given to move this forward. He added that staff has
done a very good job supplying a tremendous amount of detail, timing and interaction with
agencies to sharpen our knowledge of the situation.
MOTION by Commissioner Anderson, seconded by Commissioner Kobussen, finding that the
environmental assessment worksheet for Plymouth Creek stream bank improvements has
disclosed sufficient information for the City Council to make a decision on the need for an EIS.
Vote. 6 Ayes. MOTION approved.
8. ADJOURNMENT
MOTION by Chair Davis, without objection, to adjourn the meeting at 8:35 p.m.