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HomeMy WebLinkAboutPark and Recreation Advisory Commission Minutes 11-14-20191 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 Approved Minutes Park & Recreation Advisory Commission Thursday, November 14, 2019 MEMBERS PRESENT: Chair Tricia DeBleeckere, Vice Chair Dick Burkhardt, Commissioners: Margie DuPuis, Ann Hoekstra, Marilyn Sunseri, Michael Swanson, Vita Wilson MEMBERS ABSENT: STAFF PRESENT: Parks & Recreation Director Diane Evans, Deputy Director Barb Northway, Recreation Manager Kari Hemp, Creek Center Manager Chris Fleck, Project Coordinator Sonja Rippe, Office Support Specialist Sarah Josephs COUNCIL REPRESENTATIVES: City Council Member Alise McGregor, Planning Commissioner Bryan Oakley 1. CALL TO ORDER Chair DeBleeckere called the meeting to order at 6:57 p.m. 2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Motion by Vice Chair Burkhardt and seconded by Commissioner Sunseri recommending approval of the July 11 Park and Recreation Advisory Commission meeting minutes as written. With all members voting in favor, the motion carried. 3. OPEN FORUM: Paul Hillen of 16130 48th Avenue North in Plymouth spoke during Open Forum. “Hello, my name is Paul Hillen and I’ve lived at 16130 48th Ave. N. in Plymouth for 18 years. I’m a member of the “Preserve Hollydale Green Space and Golf Course Committee” who represent 9 neighborhoods on and around the Hollydale Golf Course. These neighborhoods are comprised of over 500 Plymouth Homeowners, over 1,000 Plymouth City Taxpayers, and over 3,000 City Plymouth residents. On behalf of those residents, I am here to ask the Plymouth City Pa rks and Recreation Advisory Commission (PRAC) to advise the City Council to study and pursue the purchase of the Hollydale Golf Course and operate it as: 1) An 18 hole golf course; 2) A recreational green space; and, 3) A community gathering space for Plymouth residents. Why are we asking for the PRAC to consider this? 1. The procurement and operation of the Hollydale Golf Course by the City is consistent with the 2040 City of Plymouth Comprehensive Plan, approved by the city council on July 23, 2019; just 15 weeks ago! 2. The potential for this land is far greater than just an 18-hole golf course, it can be a year-round center of community activity and recreation space that can be the envy of every other city in Minnesota. 3. Despite what some believe, golf is not only NOT DEAD, but it is growing. 4. The cost and methodology of acquiring and operating the recreation space is achievable. So, what can Hollydale Golf Course and Greenspace become in the Future? 2 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 In addition to being a profitable, wonderful greenspace that provides a great recreation venue for ages 4 to 104 in Plymouth, it can be so much more. As a kid I grew up with a public golf course that embraced all four seasons. It was the home of cross-country meets, fall festivals, cross country ski trails, ice skating trails, a winter carnival, a winter picnic, neighborhood barn parties, spring fling, learn to golf clinics, youth clinics, youth tournaments, and of course golf leagues for all ages. The course was used every week of the year and was the center of the community. This is what Hollydale can be for the city of Plymouth. With a little vision and imagination, this is a very doable thing. Golf Is NOT Dead Similar to what Mark Twain said, the death of golf has been greatly exaggerated. AND, the city of Plymouth agrees. In fact, City Officials have been talking about golf and its importance to Plymouth since the ‘90s. The 2020 Comp Plan relied heavily on the results of a public survey. It said "According to the survey, a large number – 52% of Plymouth residents indicated they or another member of their household play golf. The overwhelming majority of these golfers – 89% do not belong to a private club. These golfers tend to play one course regularly, and play at Hollydale, Baker National, and Elm Creek most often. 37% reported they play more than 20 times a year. A significant number (28%) reported they play over 30 times a year. This level of participation would rank golf second, behind walking, as the most frequent recreational activity of Plymouth residents.” As we know, Elm Creek was sold in 2014 and has now been developed into housing. The survey also asked Plymouth residents’ interest in keeping those courses. 79% thought the city "should take steps to assure at least one of these courses remains open to the public", and 54% favored spending funds to keep at least one of the courses open. The conclusion in the 2020 Comp Plan was "In order to satisfy resident desires and to maintain the present high level of service, quality of life, recreational diversity, and protection and enhancement of natural areas, it is important Plymouth strive to preserve publicly accessible golf courses in the City." Golf is not dying. It's an $80 billion industry. 33.5 million people golf. In fact, participation is at the same level as 1995, when Tiger Woods came on the scene and made it more popular. In fact, the sport is growing again. In 2018, the National Golf Foundation reports nearly a 4% increase in overall golf participation, and the largest number of beginners (2.6 million) ever in history. Demand is being driven by venues like Top Golf, the junior segment, girls and non-Caucasians. The other myth about golf is that it's not profitable. This is not true. Hollydale today is profitable and would not have remained open during Plymouth's building boom if it had been losing money. Additionally, we have met with multiple owners/operators of public golf courses, all of w hom are profitable, and, would be willing to share their knowledge on this effort. Additionally, we have discovered several different ways to purchase, finance and payout a golf course. How a business performs is a function how it is operated and supply and demand. And in Plymouth, where supply is down with the closure of three 18-hole golf courses, demand for the game is strong. The National Golf Foundation estimates there are 68,000 golfers within a 10-mile radius of Hollydale, and 20,000 golfers within 5 miles. 20,000 is a lot more people than play pickle ball, or tennis, or pickup basketball, or do yoga, or go to indoor play places. 3 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 And while people of all ages play golf, the propensity to play golf more frequently increases with age, suggesting a great match with Plymouth's demographics. Plymouth is aging, there are now more residents in the 55 to 79 group than teens and kids. Plymouth is a community of wonderful amenities - especially for kids. We have playgrounds, athletic fields, a field house, ice rinks, swimming pools, walking trails, and great school facilities. But if we let Hollydale get plowed over and completely destroyed, what we won't have is a golf course, and we’ll be the biggest city in the state without an 18 hole golf course . Golf is a favorite place for many in the growing, older demographic. The loss of the golf course will be a loss for the city. We won't have that big, quiet, space outdoors where we can walk with our friends for six miles and work on a skill that exercises the brain as well as the body. Where we can join a league and make new friends and create community. Where we can spend four hours with our kids or our grandkids and play together in a beautiful, natural environment, outdoors without the distractions of phones and screens. Golf Fits with the 2040 Comp Plan Now, 20 years later, the 2040 Comp Plan, while using fewer words than the 2020 plan, essentially says the same thing. Paraphrasing, it says, "Golf is recognized by the City as a sport that is important to many Plymouth residents. The consideration of public golf in the city is important for recreational diversity, provision of green space and quality of life. As Plymouth’s population increases, it will be important to ensure that this recreational diversity, natural resource preservation and quality of life are continued." We agree. So do city residents. Our petition to save Hollydale has now reached over 1700 people – - that’s more than the number of respondents to the Flash Survey that justified $51 million for the PCC. Today we have an opportunity with Hollydale, and we ask you to not let it pass. BECAUSE, once it's gone, it's gone forever. Why destroy this jewel in the middle of Plymouth? So, our ask of you is this: As an Advisory Commission, we ask that you advise both the City Parks and Rec Department and the City Council, to study and develop a plan for the City of Plymouth to acquire and operate the Hollydale golf course and recreation space consistent with the 2040 Comprehensive Plan. Thank You.” 4. PRESENTATIONS (NON-ACTION ITEMS): 4a. Cartegraph Asset Management & Operations Caretegraph is an asset management and operations software. The City of Plymouth went live with the software in December of 2018. The software tracks requests, work orders, assets, resources, and reports. There are currently over 55,000 assets loaded into the program for the Parks division alone. An asset is anything physical that the city maintains; bench, building, garbage can, tree, fence. The software is also being used with Public Works, Streets, Utilities, and Engineering. The Plymouth Ice Center and Plymouth Creek Center/Fieldhouse will begin using the software in the next few months. Since the site has gone live, we have received over 740 service requests from the public. Most requests have been weed (400+) or tree (140+) complaints. Weed complaints are typically when a neighbor calls and reports that their neighbor’s weeds are over 8”. The tree complaints are able to be assigned to the specific tree that the concern is regarding. Each tree on public or park property that is of a certain age or size has been logged in the software. There are over 36,000 trees logged and each can have tasks assigned to them. 4 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 When logging in a reported issue or concern, the software links with the city’s geographic information system (GIS) so that the crew can know exactly where the work will need to be completed. The issue is then tracked with what service was completed, any expenses incurred, and follow up conversations with the resident. Prior to the software, issues or concerns came in via voicemail, email, in person, post -its, and in person. Tracking and managing all of the tasks was cumbersome at best. Since going live, nearly 9,700 tasks have been completed. In 2020 staff will be adding an app to integrate Cartegraph to the city website so that residents can log in and submit requests via our website that then load directly into Cartegraph. The new app is called SeeClickFix and will take the place of the extra emails that are coming in through Outlook and then being manually loaded into Cartegraph. Once the feature is ready the Communications department will notify residents of the process and how to use it. 5. NEW BUSINESS (ACTION ITEMS): 5a. NWG Trailhead Building Recreation Manager Kari Hemp provided an update on Phase 5 of the Northwest Greenway project. City Council has approved the overall project, the next step is for Commissioners to provide feedback on the park shelter building design. The project is scheduled in the 2020 Capital Improvement Program (CIP) using Park Dedication Funds. On November 26, staff will present the Commissioners feedback to Council. The concept plan provides for seating for 150 people, with spill-over space for large events and vista views. There will also be indoor restrooms, a serving area, green room, storage space, and a room for staff. The roof options for Commissioners to choose from are: Option 1: Butterfly roof Option 2: Shed roof Option 3: Flat roof Commissioner DuPuis asked if there were much difference in shade coverage during sunny times between options 1 and 3. Manager Hemp shared that the consultants have reviewed those factors and all three roofs would work fairly equal during any difference in weather. Commissioner Hoekstra asked if snow or rain would collect and build up in the butterfly roof style. Manager Hemp shared that the roof would be designed to drain well and prevent any pooling on the roof. On the ground where the water is draining will be a rain garden to absorb the large amount of rain. Commissioner Hoekstra shared that off the three roofs, she is not in favor of the butterfly roof. Commissioner Swanson asked if there was an option for the shelter to be more fully enclosed to allow for use more months of the year. Manager Hemp shared that that plan was initially looked at in the design stage, but became cost prohibited. The trails will still be plowed during the winter months so park users will still be able to walk through the Northwest Greenway in that a rea. Commissioner Wilson shared that she recently toured the area and felt it was a gorgeous piece of land. She is very excited for this project to move forward. She shared that she preferred the shed roof option. Commissioner DuPuis added that roof option 3 doesn’t look substantial. Due to the smaller size of the shelter, roofs 1 and 2 make it appear larger. Chair DeBleeckere agreed that roofs 1 and 2 made more of a visual impact on the building. 5 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 Commissioner Sunseri asked if there was any large difference in cost between the roofs or maintenance of the roofs. Manager Hemp shared that all three options cost roughly the same amount. Planning Commissioner Oakley commented on the height of the roofs. He shared that residents were concerned about the roofs being too high and they being able to see the shelter. Manager Hemp shared that the building is on a hill so there will be some residents that can see it from their homes. There will be some additional landscaping put in along the sout hern portion of the project to help buffer the view. Overall, the roof height was kept to a minimum. Commissioner Hoekstra asked if the placement of the kitchen and bathrooms the same in each design. Manager Hemp shared that the layouts are the same in each design, only the roof style is different. Currently the restrooms are in a separate area, divided by a trail , while the kitchen, green room, and seating area are all together. Motion by Vice Chair Burkhardt, seconded by Commissioner Wilson, recommending the approval of Option B: Shed roof for the Northwest Greenway Phase 5 Trailhead Shelter. 5b. Plymouth Creek Center Renovation & Expansion Project Plymouth Creek Center Manager Chris Fleck provided an update on the Plymouth Creek Center renovation and expansion project. Currently staff and architects are looking at the needs and look of the inside rooms, storage rooms, and the exterior of the building. Consultants are also running tests on the soil and water surrounding the Plymouth Creek Center. Staff are reviewing ways that the project can meet B3 standards, which would be required by the State of MN if the project receives State Bonding Funds. Standards include meeting sustainability goals for site, water, energy, indoor environment, materials, and w aste. The building designs and development documents are anticipated to be completed by the end of 2019. Construction documents would then be completed in early 2020. If approved by Council, the project would break ground in the fall of 2020. Chair DeBleeckere inquired if the project team has been working with the utility companies to ensure maximizing any energy rebates available. Manager Fleck shared that both Centerpoint Energy and Xcel Energy have been involved in the planning process and have provided a great deal of insight into ways to maximize energy savings. There is also a free program run through the State in which a sub consultant architect studies the best rebate programs available to find the best systems for the project and provide a lower annual cost. The current building is very heavy with conference space. The new site would add more active play and fitness spaces. The administration offices would move toward the entrance of the building to have a better flow as well as a view of the indoor playground. The circular stairs in the center of the building would be removed to provide a better flow of traffic around the ballroom area. There are plans to add three classrooms on the first floor for senior classes and activities with three classrooms above on the second floor for recreation and multi-purpose classes and meetings. This will allow larger rental groups to host an event using the ballroom and have additional spaces for break-out rooms. The east side of the building will be the active activity side of the building. That side will have two indoor gyms, fitness rooms, gender neutral changing rooms, and indoor playground, and party 6 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 rooms. Above the gyms will be an indoor walking track that walkers can complete a mile in 6 -7 laps. Mechanical systems will be in place to support a potential third gym. The plans include combining Meeting Room 3 and the Black Box Theater for a larger theater space. There will be a green room added across the hall. Staff are also adding new unique rooms such as; sensory rooms, nursing rooms, a green room, and an art gallery. Commissioner Wilson inquired if the indoor playground would be specific to one age group. Manager Fleck shared that the playground would be playable for all ages; babies – at least 13 years old. Adults and grandparents are welcome to play too. Commissioner Wilson shared that she was pleased to see the number of lounges included in the plans. It’s often hard to find a place to meet people. This will be a nice feature to have areas to si te and gather with others. Gery Haag of 4960 Comstock Lane in Plymouth spoke after the presentation. “My name is Gery Haag, my address is 4960 Comstock Lane N. Plymouth. I am here this evening to discuss the expansion of Plymouth Creek Center. I will have to admit I did not hear much about the proposed expansion over the months and years it has been in the planning stage, so I have a lot of research. I want to make clear I am not here to say I am for or against. These are a few of many articles written that has given me a good understanding of The Project. One article reported: the expansion is to take the existing 30,000 square foot Creek Center that was built in 2000 and expand it to 80,000 square feet to host an indoor walking track, senior activity spaces, art spaces, health and wellness spaces and 2 gymnasiums, according to the city's Director of Parks and Recreation Diane Evans. Another article reported: approx. 300 people attended an open house, spending an average of 20- 30 minutes talking to council members or staff. Just over 200 feedback forms were turned in after the open house. Staff created a flash vote survey, 1,145 people participated in the survey. Another article reported: three Council members voted against the resolution — Jim Prom, Nick Roehl and Alise McGregor. All three cited similar concerns about the project and its timing. “I am not in support of doing this now,” Prom said at the meeting. “I honestly think we should wait until we do the rest of the things we need to do. I’m not against doing it when we don’t have other things coming down the line. But I will tell you as a Council member for the last five years, it’s surprising how things come up after we make decisions on things.” The point I want make this evening is I believe $52 million is way too much to spend on 2 Gyms, an indoor walking track, an indoor playground, an art gallery, an art room, a renovated ballroom, and new community rooms. Plymouth already has 45 playgrounds, 72 athletic fields, a field house, 13 outdoor ice rinks, 3 indoor ice rinks, 4 swimming pools, 172 miles of walking trails, and an entire health club we can go to without being a member. In addition, Wayzata Schools alone has 6 theaters, 18 gymnasiums, 6 tennis courts, approximately 500 classrooms, STEM facilities that are among the best in the nation, exquisite music practice spaces, and a dome for winter sports. Do we really need a $51 MM expansion of Plymouth Creek Center? 7 Approved Minutes November 14, 2019 As a resident and taxpayer of Plymouth I have a hard time with supporting a $52 million expansion. If I was a Councilman sitting on the City of Plymouth council, I would have to vote no on spending this kind of money, especially with a flash vote of only 1,145. To me 1,145 votes is showing the project does not have much community support at all. I am not saying we don’t upgrade the existing community center, what I am asking is to take part of the $52 million and invest it in the purchase of Hollydale Golf Course. We could do both.” 5c. 2020 Meeting Schedule In looking ahead to the PRAC meetings in 2020, there are six meetings on the schedule. More may be added as projects or open houses become needed. At this time, all meetings are scheduled at City Hall in the Council Chambers. Chair DeBleeckere is unable to attend the meetings in January and February. Vice Chair Burkhardt will lead the meetings if able to attend. Motion by Vice Chair Burkhardt, seconded by Commissioner Swanson, recommending the approval of the 2020 Meeting Schedule. 6. COMMISSIONER/STAFF UPDATE  Old Fashioned Christmas will be held on Saturday, December 7 at Plymouth Creek Playfield.  Tickets are now available for After Hours at the Creek, our adults-only event held on January 24 at the Plymouth Creek Center.  A new, 1-day event, Discover Plymouth will be held on April 18 at the Fieldhouse. This event will combine the City Sampler, State of the City, Home Expo, and Health Fair while promoting recreation programs, local businesses, non-profits, volunteer opportunities, and organizations. There will also be a kid’s play area and touch-a-truck interactive zone.  Halloween at the Creek was very well attended again this year. We had a record turnout with just over 1,700 people at the event. 7. ADJOURNMENT Motion by Commissioner Swanson, seconded by Commissioner Wilson, recommending adjournment of the Park and Recreation Advisory Commission meeting. With no objection, Chair DeBleeckere adjourned the meeting at 8:23 p.m.